Talk:Grunt

Legality
Is it legal to copy/paste an article like that? 114.73.163.118 04:16, 19 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Something I was wondering myself. I think because the source is provided it is ok, but not 100% and as more information is received this page will see a lot of changes.

Ascension
His wikipedia description states he appears or was at least mentioned in Ascension. Does anyone who's read the book remember in what context? --TheWilsonator 17:18, October 23, 2009 (UTC)


 * Pretty sure that's a load of you-know-what. Wikipedia is far from reliable, after all. If I am proven wrong, I will gladly retract the previous statements, but I do not recall Grunt being in Ascension at all. SpartHawg948 11:48, November 6, 2009 (UTC)
 * No, no, no. On Wikipedia it says "He is encountered on Omega, a space station located in the Terminus Systems and first mentioned in the novel Mass Effect: Ascension", it means Omega was first mentioned in Ascension, not Grunt. --Joshtopher27 19:48, November 17, 2009 (UTC)

Only 22!
Grunt is only 22 years old, which i find refreshing. While Wrex's age isn't really nailed down, I think it's safe to say he's pretty old. It'll be cool to see a more youthful Krogan in action. Effectofthemassvariety 03:21, December 8, 2009 (UTC)

So he is basically a krogan teenager? Nice!


 * In all likelihood that's not his actual age. As explained by one of the developers the website people may have gotten his age from casting documents and 22 represents a human age equivalent. Anyway, it's sounding like 22 isn't is age, and the cinematic trailer lists him as 300+, which isn't enough evidence to put him as 300+ either, but it shows that his age is still unknown. JakePT 03:33, December 14, 2009 (UTC)
 * You made that up, nothing lists his age as 300+ unless of course you count the backwards number that is after a word that cannot be read. THe official website lists it a 22 therefore that is his age. 68.61.39.252 12:03, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
 * All you have to do is take the frame from the Blur Trailer which shows grunts profile and flip it in paint, and voila, you can clearly read all the info. It clearly says Age:300, Species: Krogan, Genophage: Infertile, Gender: M and other information about grunt. Now 22, might be his age... in Tuchanka years. Since we don't know the orbital period of Tuchanka this is irrelevant. But notice on Samara's Bio it says estimated 600 human years for age, but not for other alien characters. Now, considering that Krogan can live for over 1000 years, a 300 year old Krogan might be the equivalent of a 22 year old human. Consider the following: Humans can live 150 years. A 22 year old human has lived about .15 of its life expectancy. Now, if a 300 year old Krogan is equivalent to a 22 year old human, that means the average life expectancy is about 2000 years for Krogan. Considering that Wrex has been speculated to be about 1400 years old, this isn't an unreasonable estimate.--71.234.106.119 07:29, December 24, 2009 (UTC)
 * I have been over this with people and nobody can find any source for krogans being able to reach ages of over a thousand years, in fact that seems to be based on the assumption that all krogan alive were born before the genophage. Youcannot take the trailer as actual fact, it is only a trailer a promotional video that has no real weight when it comes to the mass effect universe, do you remeber the decisions tv spot for the first game, noveria was incorrect and i ont think the other planet even exsisted. The official age is 22 years, thats from the official website. Thats the stuff that the creators of the game have written, and thats how old he is. ralok 14:23, December 24, 2009 (UTC)


 * I suppose we'll find out won't we! And I do think that the Majority of the Krogan alive were born before the Genophage, because that's the reason there's as many as there is. The main reason their race is dying is because their breeding rates are nowhere near enough to keep up their population. As the older Krogan are dying there are none to replace them.
 * No the breeding rate is not a problem,they are capable of reproducing offspring, if they live a few centuries then it is reasonableto assume that if the krogan would sit still organize themselves and stop killing each other they couldactually have population growth, minus hte trauma of failed pregnancies. Wrex has said it, it isnt the genophage thats killing them, its themselves being idiots. ralok 16:19, December 26, 2009 (UTC)
 * Well that is a gross oversimplification of the problem. As is made clear several times, the genophage is killing the krogan, all that is affected by their behaviour is how quickly it happens. Even if Wrex gets his way and the krogan settle down and start attempting to have kids rather than killing each other, it's still going to be virtually (if not utterly) impossible for them to have any population growth. The fact that only 1 in 1000 pregnancies produces a child sees to that. All that would happen is that the decline would slow. You can't expect to see any population growth when a finite number of krogan women have to keep getting pregnant, carrying to term, and giving birth with only a 1 in 1000 chance of producing live offspring. No, it's safe to say the breeding rate is the problem. It's a numbers game, and the krogan are on the losing end. SpartHawg948 20:30, December 26, 2009 (UTC)
 * Well clearly there is a difference of opinion here. ralok 02:17, December 28, 2009 (UTC)
 * I suppose you can call it that, if you must, although the facts seem pretty clear. To quote the Codex, "The genophage makes only one in 1,000 pregnancies viable, and today the krogan are a slowly dying breed." Hmmm... slowly dying, eh? And note how the genophage is the sole reason listed as to why the krogan are dying. Again, you can't sustain a population with ever dwindling numbers, and a 1 in 1000 chance of having a child assures dwindling numbers. SpartHawg948 02:29, December 28, 2009 (UTC)
 * But you dont know how many pregnancies a krogan female is capable of a year, and they can live to be at least three hundred years (according to what info I have dug up)so there isnt enough information to say the genophage is the sole reason their race is dying, it sounds traumatic (999 failures for every succes) but that is human standards. ralok 02:36, December 28, 2009 (UTC)
 * No I don't know how many pregnancies a krogan female is capable of. What I do know is that, according to the OFFICIAL BioWare sources, "The genophage makes only one in 1,000 pregnancies viable, and today the krogan are a slowly dying breed." Slowly dying. Dying as in extinct. And it doesn't say anything in any entry about the krogan being able to do anything about it, even by doing what Wrex wants. In fact, Wrex is the only one who states that there may be a cultural aspect, and he's hardly unbiased. Official sources say the genophage is driving the krogan to extinction, not their culture. As someone said recently on another talk page, you did not create Mass Effect, ralok, BioWare did. BioWare says the genophage is killing the krogan, not their culture. Simple as that. SpartHawg948 02:42, December 28, 2009 (UTC)
 * But that was the ingame codex, i would think the testimony of a member of the species would overide what is written in the history book. I have stated my case, it is probably wrong but there it is thats what i have to say, also please do not revert that edit on the main page though, i wouldnt mind if it was in the trivia that his youth is a rarity amonngst krogan, but saying he is one of hte few alive born after the genophage is on outwardly an innocent peice of trivia, but beneath the surface is a brooding world of arguements speculation and confusion ralok
 * It is in the in-game codex. So? The in-game codex is basically considered the ultimate canon source for ME. Dialogue is often unreliable and biased. Wrex is providing support for a radical (for the krogans anyways) political/social philosophy he is espousing, which again, means that his word is hardly unbiased. The codex, on the other hand, is considered the best source aside from actually having it depicted in front of you during gameplay. Additionally, several sources support the theory that regardless of social practices, the genophage is killing the krogan. Only Wrex says anything different, and even he admits that the only way to assure the survival of his people is with Saren's cure. So again, the official sources say that yes, it is the birthrate that is killing the krogan, not the social practices of the krogan, which is demonstrated multiple times to be pure speculation. SpartHawg948 03:07, December 28, 2009 (UTC)
 * I argue different, only because it is generally confirmed in ascension that the codex is in fact an in universe tool, most likely written by humans. I expect that this is actually a prelude to explain the differences in the mass effect 2 codec, but for now I feel that a very neutral position should be taken on this subject, such as writing that the krogans problems are only worsened by their society and culture. but this is actually a large divergence from the orginal topic sentence of this talk, so I suggest that this conversation be postponed until a future time in which new information that conflict with either of our previous statements is presented, i am now going back to playing Freshly-Picked Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland. ralok 03:20, December 28, 2009 (UTC)
 * Of course the codex is an in-universe tool. That in no way, shape or form invalidates it's information. It's an in-game encyclopedia. That's why we have the policy that Codex articles are copied verbatim, and that the Codex is always right, unless directly contradicted by the game (ie the rachni). SpartHawg948 03:27, December 28, 2009 (UTC)
 * What i mean is that the codex actually exsists in the universe, rather than exsisting as a tool for the player to understand the universe better (i am sure thats what you mean aswell) however that does mean "human" error is possible (as it has been shown by the game) so basically, we have no idea until more information is presented. ralok 03:39, December 28, 2009 (UTC)

I'm guessing they lay eggs like a turtle, have like 500 eggs and forget about them, that or like a crocodile, lay a bunch of eggs and protect and go bereserk on whoever is near them, if they're alive, if they're dead, eat them and try again

err, Mordin clearly states that the genophage isn't as horrible as everyone thinks, it just keeps the krogan population normal. Sooo, is the codex incorrect? (as Mordin created a genophage) X0 RG 0x 22:13, February 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes. The codex seems to represent a 'general consensus' type of knowledge within the Mass Effect galaxy. For example, it lists the reapers as a myth and the Rachni as extinct. In mass effect 2 it describes the battle of the citadel according to the way teh council sees it (Saren was in command and Sovereign was just a big Geth ship.) It is an encyclopedia, not the actual factual knowledge as gained by Shepard.


 * And it isn't just Mordin who thinks the Genophage will not kill of the Krogan. Okeer has the same opinion and seems to think that quality instead of quantity is what the Krogan should be aiming for. 134.58.253.57 09:29, February 15, 2010 (UTC)

---SPOILER---

In the last Sci Fi Video about ME2, we can see Grunt in a Cryo Tub and Shepard "waking him up"... I think that Grunt is in fact young, but come from the "past", may be from the period of the war between the council and the Krogan Cyphius 05:12, January 20, 2010 (UTC)

--SPOILER END---

---SPOILER---

By the by, you're all wrong. If anything his age is measured in weeks if not days if you take into consideration that the flawed Krogans determine their age by the time they where released from their tubes. Born fully grown and ready to kill.

--SPOILER END---

Grunt on Tuchanka
New trailer says Grunt is recruited on Tuchanka http://kotaku.com/5425151/the-mass-effect-2-cinematic-trailer-at-the-vga. If this gets taken down, this is from the VGA that just aired tonight on Spike. Illusive Man voices over Shepard recruiting by talking to Miranda about locations he goes to and recruits, Illium and shows Thane, Purgatory and shows a shadowy bionic. Looked rather manish to me, but probably SuZe. Finally "sunny" Tuchanka where it shows Grunt fighting a Thresher Maw. I will back all this up by reminding that it has been stated Grunt is MET on Omega but Shepard is there for a salarian operative.--Xaero Dumort 02:47, December 13, 2009 (UTC)

Class
Grunt is a Vanguard, correct? I saw the intro video, but on his wiki page there was no mention, so I'm a bit confused. H-Man Havoc 17:35, December 20, 2009 (UTC)


 * I dont think so, I ont think he has biotic abilities of any type, he might have once but if hhe id that means there would be five biotic teammates in Mass Effect 2, thats alot . . . wait vangaurd are biotic right. I dont know im horribly confused. ralok 14:27, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

Vanguards are biotic warriors. I haven't seen much of his biotic powers, but he is classified as a battlemaster due to those traits. In the cinematic trailer released on Xbox LIVE, then subsequently on other sites, he gets shot at but then its shown that he has a barrier ability. Additionally, Vanguards are particularly skilled with shotguns, and that so happens to be the weapon he's using.

H-Man Havoc 20:29, December 24, 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes he gets shot and his kinetic barrier briefly shows, thats all that i can see in the cinematic. If you recall all characters have shields, in fact there is a specific moment in bring down the sky where you get shot and your shield saves you. ralok 21:58, December 24, 2009 (UTC)

I'm not discrediting this, but when Shepard gets shot, the Kinetic barrier appears to be more faint, while Grunt's is more purple. I believe this is the barrier ability at work.

H-Man Havoc 01:47, December 25, 2009 (UTC)

No, simply no. You are over analyzing somehting very minor. He is not biotic, there is four biotics on the team already. Plus that would make him to similiar to wrex. ralok 01:54, December 25, 2009 (UTC)
 * There's actually 5 biotics (Miranda, Jacob, SuZe, Thane, and Samara). So yeah, Grunt is definitely not biotic. As for a class, I'm sure he's some sort of soldier variant.--Matt 2108 01:59, December 25, 2009 (UTC)

Who's SuZE? Besides, I guess he's not. H-Man Havoc 02:26, December 25, 2009 (UTC)

Back thing
is it my imagination or is his back alot smaller than that of an average krogan. ralok 14:50, December 24, 2009 (UTC)


 * No, his "back thing" (or hump, as it is referred to in the game and by... well, by pretty much everyone) does appear to be smaller. Probably due to age, if I had to guess, but maybe we'll find out in ME2. SpartHawg948 19:44, December 24, 2009 (UTC)


 * I would have used the word hump, but i was traumatized by the usage of that word during my youth (dont ask to long of a story) so i just avoid using that word ralok 03:01, December 28, 2009 (UTC)
 * The 'hump' is likely smaller due to genetics and such, a smaller hump on a Krogan is like a smaller hump on a camel, the programers probably just loaded one simple template in ME and now we might see greater variation, in the main characters atleast.Kre &#39;Nunumee 04:07, January 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * There is no evidence that the size of the hump is genetic. Nor is the size of a camel's hump a genetic matter, at least not purely one of genetics. The hump of a camel is, of course, full of fat, which provides the camel with energy/sustenance when necessary. When the fatty stores start to get used up, the hump gets smaller. It is also theorized that the hump minimizes the amount of heat trapped by the rest of their bodies, as the insulating fat is contained in one area, as opposed to being all over the camels body, which would be an advantageous feature for an animal that lives in the desert. Likewise, we know exactly what the krogan hump is for, as the codex entry on krogan biology makes it pretty clear: "The hump on krogan's back stores water and fats that help the krogan survive lean times. Large humps are a point of pride; being well-fed implies the krogan is a superior predator." Note the absence of references to genetics. SpartHawg948 06:04, January 20, 2010 (UTC)

Bony Ridge
There has been no indication yet as to why Grunt's "forehead ridge" looks different than those seen on other krogans. It could possibly be an age thing (although as you will note above, the age issue is somewhat contentious), it could be due to Grunt belonging to some krogan offshoot, or it could be any of a number of other things- malnutrition (which could also be responsible for his smaller than normal back hump), genetic abnormality and/or birth defect, some sort of deficiency within his system, prior injury, purposeful cosmetic alteration, etc. So please people, let's avoid the speculation. There is a blanket statement in place that says the reason for the difference is not yet known. Once we do know more, that can be updated. Till then though, any guesswork is... SPECULATION!!! (bet nobody saw that coming! :P ) SpartHawg948 22:43, December 26, 2009 (UTC)


 * It'd be pretty interesting to see Bioware push it as a cosmetic body alteration practiced by the krogan, in the same vein of human reconstructive modification; we'd have a lot more cool-looking krogan. MarinesNeverDie 01:24, December 30, 2009 (UTC)
 * Perhaps they've just upped the resolution and detailing of alien features this time so you can see even the minutest of minute details? Phylarion 11:39, January 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * That could be, but the only other krogan we've really seen from ME2 so far (the supposed Gatatog Uvenk from the Stars of Mass Effect Video, who is shown while Michael Dorn is talking) appears to have the same type of forehead ridge that Wrex and all the other non-Grunt krogans we've seen thus far have. If this is the case, it does suggest that something is different about Grunt. SpartHawg948 11:50, January 16, 2010 (UTC)
 * My personal theory is that, assuming he is in fact a "young" krogan, the boniness of the crest is a result of the genetic alterations caused by the genophage. Pax.ephemeral 16:14, January 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Its most likely that he is a tank-bred krogan. Im sure the Krogan Comandeer who bred him (Okeer, was it?) didn't make a perfect replica. Kit-Kat-Kun 03:16, January 28, 2010 (UTC)

Ibeeis I'm pretty sure it's because of his age. If you wander around Tuchanka a bit and have conversations with local Krogan (Uvenk and Shaman in particular) while Grunt is in your party they'll often mention "growing plates" in the same fashion you'd use any other "go grow up" metaphor. "Plates" here obviously being their forehead armor. It might be better to ask around at ME2 official forums so that we have a definite source to quote before adding anything though. 19:48, January 31, 2010 (UTC)

Protected Page
Ok, here's the deal. I hate protecting pages (this is only the 9th time a page has been protected here in over two years), but for some reason unregistered users seem to want to A) Delete content for no reason (use edit summaries people, PLEASE!!!) and B) Add in pointless speculation (there are all kinds of reasons the ridge could be different, which is why the catch-all "the reason is unknown" statement... why then add one speculative reason and not others?), so for the time being the page is being protected, which will prevent new and unregistered users from editing the page. Hopefully soon some new info will come up that will allow this to be lifted. Worst case, I don't really see this protection being necessary past 26 Jan, when ME2 releases. SpartHawg948 04:12, December 30, 2009 (UTC)


 * Honestly I doubt that they will explain it, personally i think it is his age, or malnutrition. I wouldnt bother protecting the page. Since i dont have a job and am essentially worthless to the proffeessional world in my current state of being i will help out whenever i can, i think i have already reverted it like three times (maybe only once). So the fact is that you might have to protect the page after ME2 is released, because they probably wont explain it, But wait until then. ralok 04:26, December 30, 2009 (UTC)


 * Well, it's been popping up at least five times a day lately, and I've pretty much been the only one having to clean up the mess, although one or two other users have also helped once or twice. As for waiting, I think you misunderstood. I wasn't asking for opinions on something I was considering, I was explaining an action I had already done. It's kind of hard to wait to do something you've already done! :P And while it may not be explained, it seems likely that there will be at least some indication of why he is different, as BioWare is fairly good at tying up loose ends. We'll just have to wait and see. SpartHawg948 05:25, December 30, 2009 (UTC)
 * I was thinking about this earlier when I saw that someone yet again edited the section about the bony ridge... it's like some weird conspiracy was going on. Matt 2108 06:54, December 30, 2009 (UTC)
 * Indeed... I don't normally like talking about conspiracies (I always feel like I need to wear a tin-foil hat when I do :P) but it does at least appear a little odd, so many anon users inserting pretty much the exact same thing multiple times a day, or deleting the same section time after time. Oh well, it's probably nothing. SpartHawg948 07:39, December 30, 2009 (UTC)

Voice Actor
Okay, does anyone know who is the voice behind Grunt. I heard plenty of suggestions, and right now I think it's Clancy Brown (aka the Kurgan and DCAU Lex Luthor). This is particularly obvious in the "Meet Grunt" trailer. Someone please put me out of my misery and tell me.--88.107.173.106 16:35, January 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure if it's legit, but I found this on Steve Blum's website: "Also pick up Mass Effect 2. Beautiful game! I’m Grunt in that one. Love that guy! He has issues, just like me!"--Morlan 23:11, January 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * Seems pretty legit if it's his official site... Damn, his credits list on wikipedia is insane.--Matt 2108 23:18, January 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * I see a few people on the BW forums have speculated that Blum is Grunt's VA as well. It just seems strange to have him voice similar (violent berserker-types) companions in back-to-back BW games (Oghren in DA:O).--Morlan 23:55, January 7, 2010 (UTC)
 * Clancy Brown would have been a huge get... you think he would have been in the voice actor trailer.--Matt 2108 16:37, January 7, 2010 (UTC)

Mercenary?
how is he a mercenary if he joins you right as he's born..? krogan super-soldier is what i'd put instead

Big Game Hunters
A big game hunter is a hunter who hunts large animals. The thresher maw is quite large. So I doubt this is a reference to anything aside from the term. It is a very vague similarity between the achievement and a map in Starcraft. Therefore I will delete this "reference". If you disagree feel free to revert my edit.99.145.176.205 05:06, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

Killing Grunt
The article says, "It is possible to fail to persuade Grunt to join the party if Shepard is not careful with dialogue options after waking him up, resulting in Shepard killing the krogan." So which dialogue options do that? I've explored all of them, and while some lead to Shepard shooting Grunt, none lead to his death. First set is Grunt wanting a name: "You'll get more than that," and "Of course." Second set is "Why 'Grunt'?" and "You want to die?" Third set is "Join my crew. We'll find it," "You feel nothing for Okeer," "My command is your reason," "Stand down or else" and "I released you. You owe me." The last two will lead to a Renegade interrupt, "You leave me no choice," and "I was being generous"; all of which result in Shepard shooting Grunt, but not fatally. So what am I missing? &mdash;Seburo 18:03, February 14, 2010 (UTC)