Talk:Lair of the Shadow Broker

Weapons
The screenshots feature the M5 pistol and a new assault rifle. Mention? Or too speculative? JakePT 16:34, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * For now too speculative as we had the M5 featured before and nothing came of it. Keep it here however and here's hoping for the new pistol and a new assault rifle to boot. We'll just have to follow the story, but I am interested in the asari seen.
 * Oh wait I just realized, I've got more walkthoughs to write, and my fingers are already protesting. Lancer1289 16:38, July 22, 2010 (UTC)


 * There is new shotgun too, I think, look at one of the pictures. Captain Gavorn

I don't play anyone who uses shotgun, so I'm not really sure how they each look compacted, but I think you're right. At any rate, definitely using a new pistol and assault rifle. Just hope they are part of the pack.--Xaero Dumort 17:14, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, looks like all those people who said there would be a Liara/Shadow Broker DLC were right. And all those people who said there wouldn't are wrong. Good thing I kept quite, and opted for a policy of armed neutrality, like the Swiss. :P SpartHawg948 17:20, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

How about a short line saying something like: "Official screenshots depict three new weapons, an Assault Rifle, Shotgun and Heavy Pistol. Whether or not they are included as part of Lair of the Shadow Broker is currently unknown."? JakePT 17:33, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm of the opinion that it's worth mentioning in the article. -- Dammej ( talk ) 17:59, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Why would we add a bit about it being unknown whether or not they'll be included? It seems to me that, if this caveat has to be added, then there is no reason to add any of the above info to this article. I could see that going into the DLC article, but to go into this article, not so much. SpartHawg948 18:00, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, frankly it's pretty obvious that they will be part of the DLC, it's just we don't have 100% confirmation, I don't see an issue with including the info, but hedging our bets. Perhaps unknown was too strong a word, 'unclear' is probably more appropriate.JakePT 18:04, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm still not so sure. Again, what is the point of putting a blurb into an article about ONE SPECIFIC DLC (i.e. this one) that 'there will be new weapons, although it's unclear if they'll be in this DLC' (paraphrasing of course). If it's unclear, why should it even be here? I'm fine adding the weapon info in, just not the caveats about how 'even though these are mentioned specifically in the article for this DLC, they may not be in this DLC'. See what I'm driving at? SpartHawg948 18:07, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Addendum- why not just add the first bit? The "Official screenshots depict three new weapons, an Assault Rifle, Shotgun and Heavy Pistol."? After all, there is literally nothing in there that is inaccurate, and nothing that would be rendered so if the weapons are not in the DLC. They will still have appeared in the screenshots. We're not stating the weapons will be in the DLC, just that they're in the first 3 screenshots for the DLC. And it avoids the silly and needless 'they may not even be in the DLC' blurb. That's the point I'm attempting (rather poorly, it seems) to drive home here. SpartHawg948 18:11, July 22, 2010 (UTC)


 * I understand that, it just seems a little odd having a sentence commenting on the screenshots without tying it back to the DLC in some way. If I were reading it I'd go "And?". JakePT 18:14, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * I get that, but I'd rather go 'And?' than read the next sentence and think to myself 'Well that was stupid. If they may not even be in this, why are they even mentioned?' That's just me though. Again, I don't see any need for caveats to factually accurate statements. And you could easily tie it back to the DLC simply by altering it to 'Official screenshots for Lair of the Shadow Broker...' SpartHawg948 18:17, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Alright then. I added a sentence that sounds OK, but without any caveats. Not sure if it should go where I put it, or in it's own section though. JakePT 18:19, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * I think it's fine where you put it. Adding more sections at this early date seems like unnecessary compartmentalization. When we get more info on the weapons themselves, I can see a separate weapons section, but there simply isn't enough info as of yet. SpartHawg948 18:21, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

Why not just put it in the DLC article, as SpartHawg originally mentioned? I believe the Kestrel armor was mentioned there first as being depicted in screenshots. It's possible that this is another "accidental" reveal of another DLC pack. -- Dammej ( talk ) 18:19, July 22, 2010 (UTC)


 * Are y'all talking about the actual Downloadable Content article or the DLC section on ME2? Last I checked, speculative/uncertain stuff like this would go somewhere in the latter. -- Commdor (Talk) 18:23, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

Yes. Or, maybe... Or [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CEP2sq99Hc sic semper ty.. cough]. Hadn't given it that much thought, truth be told. SpartHawg948 18:27, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

Apparently concept art from the new Assault Rifle has showed up in the past, much like we saw an early Zaeed months before ME2 was released. For those curious (from the official forums):

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/9311/beznzvuho.png JakePT 18:30, July 22, 2010 (UTC)


 * Intriguing. I like the design and color. I'm hoping it turns out to be a good alternative to the Revenant, something with accuracy that also packs a punch. -- Commdor (Talk) 18:37, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

As tweeted to me by lead gameplay designer Christina Norman: "All I can say is, no, the new weapons you see in those screenshots are not from Shadow Broker. Can't say where they are from!" Case closed I guess. JakePT 19:15, July 22, 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks for getting clarification on that. It increases the possibility that this DLC might be post-ME2 as adding new weapons with it would likley mean otherwise as Bioware would want players to experience any new weaponry thoroughly. --The Illusive Man 19:30, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * So Liara's DLC wasn't phony as we thought, sweet :D Shadowhawk27 20:49, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

I'm getting real tired of weapons and armor being shown off in DLC teasers that they have nothing to do with. I'm also still hoping for more appearance packs soon. Everyone needs that third costume.--Xaero Dumort 20:52, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ummm... hate to ask, but why is Twitter being treated as a valid source? Not questioning JakePT's info or anything, but we do have sourcing standards, and Twitter, to the best of my knowledge, does not meet those requirements. If we accept Twitter for this, we really need to accept it as a source for everything, and I personally am pretty opposed to that idea. I mean, we also don't allow MySpace and Facebook as sources. SpartHawg948 22:01, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * OK I missed this whole thing so I have two things to comment on. First, I do think that it is very annoying that BioWare shows screenshots with new weapons and then we have a source claiming that they aren't being used. Really, I mean come on, if you aren't going to put the weapons int he pack, then don't show then and get everybody's hopes up.
 * Second the source, I do agree with Spart that accepting Twitter as a valid source really does set a very dangerous president. If we were to get something from a more valid source, then I have to agree, but Twitter I really do have problems with, along with any social networking site. They seem to be good for communicating information, but as a valid source, not so much. As with Spart, not questioning the info, but using Twitter, or any other social networking site sets a dangerous president, and puts us on a slippery slope if you know what I mean. Lancer1289 22:07, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * "Twitter" really isn't the source here. It's a tweet by Christa Norman, whom I would consider a valid source. If it was just some random person tweeting this, then I'd agree with you, but this is her twitter account. Why wouldn't we consider information she tweets to be accurate? -- Dammej ( talk ) 22:09, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * But Twitter is the source. After all, what independent verification do we have that it is her? We also wouldn't accept statements from her if they were sourced using an article from a website or publication that is known to print unproven or false information, which has happened in the past. She may be the end source, but the means of transmission is suspect. SpartHawg948 22:12, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Sorry, but this is probably the most ridiculous thing you've ever done. JakePT 22:22, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * I happen to think I've done more ridiculous things than this. I mean, what did I do? I stated that a social networking site with no real means of independent verification is not an acceptable source. We don't consider IMDB a valid source in and of itself, nor 'official' forum comments other than those that are clearly labeled as from BioWare staffers. We didn't accept Christina Norman's own comments on this very site until it was determined it actually was her. Hardly ridiculous. SpartHawg948 22:25, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * It seems JakePT doesn't get it at all, cause he keeps posting up this info when you guys state it's not valid. Shadowhawk27 01:47, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Actually if you would look at the page history, it was Spart that reposted it once Jake had provided backup about the Twitter account. I'm not comfortable using it, but since he has backup, to quote Spart in his edit summary, "[w]ell, now that I've been presented with ALL the relevant info, not just some of it, I can say (much as I hate to make sole exceptions) that THIS ONE AND ONLY Twitter account is valid for sourcing". So I guess we'll make an exception, JUST THIS ONCE. I just hope this doesn't set a president for people to start posting form Facebook, MySpace, other unknown Twitter accounts, or from any other social networking sites. Lancer1289 02:04, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Hmm, well we don't know if she's the real deal or some imposter claiming to be that person. I however am still doing my best to get some answers from Chris Priestly about the guns that are shown in the pics. Shadowhawk27 02:43, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, we do know she is the real deal and not some impostor. That's why I re-added the info. I do have at least some idea of what I'm doing, contrary to your expressed opinions. Thanks for demonstrating a total lack of faith in my basic competence though. That's always appreciated. SpartHawg948 02:51, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Forgive me SpartHawg948, i didn't know, i was only following protocol. :( Shadowhawk27 02:58, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * I must have missed the protocol that says that when two admins say a source is valid and re-add an item, you're supposed to question them and accuse a third user of not listening to those very same admins. That protocol must have gotten introduced on my day off. SpartHawg948 03:04, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * I think part of the confusion here arises because the evidence was presented on mine and JakePT's talk pages and not here. For the benefit of other editors coming to this page, here's the link that JakePT provided as corroborating evidence that the twitter account "truffle" does indeed belong to Christina Norman: http://meforums.bioware.com/viewtopic.html?topic=683748&forum=144
 * Note that about half way down there is a post by Christina Norman (her affiliation with Bioware can be verified by the presence of the "Bioware" image under her name), and note that her signature says: "twitter: truffle". Therefore, the twitter account "truffle" belongs to Christina Norman. -- Dammej ( talk ) 03:06, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok ok, i was only following the rules to this site, and you say this info is legit then i have nothing againest it. I'll try to get some answers from Chris Priestly about the guns that are shown in the pics. Shadowhawk27 03:13, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Again though, what rule to this site were you following? That's what I'm driving at. After all, one of the main rules of the site is that the admins are the ultimate arbiters in these matters. Validity of sourcing is something we have final say over, and even after one admin told you that it was valid, which is why another admin had added it, you still said it wasn't legit. That's what got me steamed. Questioning the competence of not one, but two admins. Saying 'I was following rules' or protocols or whatever only works when an actual rule was being adhered to, and I can't think of any offhand that fit. SpartHawg948 03:18, July 23, 2010 (UTC)


 * Gulp* Don't be mad at me, it was a case of misunderstanding :( I don't want to be banned from this site over over this info *Scared stiff* I didn't mean to hurt anyone. Shadowhawk27 03:26, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Oh, don't worry about getting banned, it's just the NCO in me. When a judgment call is made, it is insanely frustrating to be second-guessed by someone who A) Is not the one with overall responsibility for the situation, and B) Doesn't have all the info. It's even more frustrating when that person then says 'I was just following orders' when no such orders exist. SpartHawg948 03:29, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Understandable, SpartHawg948, it was you who gave me the idea of these rules that i *ashamed* was following, "The info posted to this website has to be legit from this and that place." Shadowhawk27 03:35, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Cristina Norman just said that the weapons in the pics are not from Shadow Broker, but didn't say that they are not coming in this DLC. Ha ha and I don't know how to post a signature. Captain Gavorn.
 * Yes, she said they were not from Shadow Broker. This DLC is Lair of the Shadow Broker, aka Shadow Broker. SpartHawg948 18:55, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * You're right, I did not see that. Captain Gavorn
 * Um Please remember to sign your posts using four tildes Captain Gavorn Shadowhawk27 20:17, July 23, 2010 (UTC)

Image
Jake, anyway you can crop Shep's arm out a little more? Lancer1289 16:41, July 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Did it a little while ago, just posting this comment for posterity. JakePT 17:37, July 22, 2010 (UTC)

So, enough talk about the hypothetical weapons and the validity of twitter statements. How about the actual content of the upcoming DLC? I personally believe that the Shadow Broker is Liara's other mother. It would explain not only much of Liara's general character (motivations, thought processes, objective and independent nature, etc.), Benezia's shame and nondisclosure about her mate, and also Liara's direct and indirect interactions with the Shadow Broker. It just seems to me like the perfect plot progression, almost like from the beginning it was, dare I say, planned?Sever323 20:31, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * And where did that come from. Liara's motiviations for seeking the Shadow Broker is a direct result of what happened in Mass Effect: Redemption. Until then, Liara had absolutly no interacitons with the Shadow Broker. Also we don't konw if that asari is the Shadow Broker, or just another agent, but it will be interesting. As to Benezia's shame, Liara said that she never mentioned why, and the thought Benezia was ashamed but we don't know why. Benezia just didn't mention it for whatever reason, but shame is speculation becuase we only have Liara's opinions on the matter. Lancer1289 20:36, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * And then there's the whole wanting to kill each other thing... not sure that fits in with the mother-daughter concept. SpartHawg948 20:41, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Speaking of Shadow Broker, I think he hired the Eclipse mercenaries in one of those pics. Remember Kasumi's DLC, they were wearing Black armor instead of Yellow. Shadowhawk27 20:45, July 23, 2010 (UTC)

I thought the same about the Eclipse as well, but the Broker has his own personal army, so more likely they will be called "Broker *Blank*" or something to that effect.--Xaero Dumort 18:23, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * What do you mean, "the other asari?" I only see Liara in the screenshots. Magicman10893 04:42, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * He means Liara's other parent. The bit in question was written in response to the notion that the Shadow Broker is Liara's 'father'. SpartHawg948 04:50, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * Oops, I should have put this under the top section. That guy mentioned something about, "The other asari seen." Also, while I'm here, what is the M5 pistol? Someone else mentioned it on X360A.org and I didn't know what he was talking about. I tried looking for it on here and got no luck.
 * There was no luck because the M5 pistol, for all intents and purposes, doesn't exist. It's part of an upcoming DLC. All that's known about it is the name, and what it looks like. As for the other bit, the user mentioned 'the asari seen'. Nothing about the 'other' asari. And, after all, Liara is 'the asari seen in the screenshots. SpartHawg948 06:31, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * The M5 could be the Phalanx pistol released in the Firepower pack (today), if they decided to rename it. FridgeRaider88 12:54, August 3, 2010 (UTC)

Benezia's shame was probably because of the whole Asari-Asari pureblood prejudice thing explained in ME2. Jake200493 12:18, August 3, 2010 (UTC)

Something to note
I can't source this because I haven't located the source itself (it's allegedly on BioWare's forums), so take this with a grain of salt: Apparently, the Lair of the Shadow Broker DLC won't be released until late August at the earliest, however the three new weapons will be released in a DLC pack sometime prior to LSB. More info on LSB will be doled out over the course of August, and LSB has a surprise in store that BioWare doesn't want to spoil in previews. So, take that as you will. -- Commdor (Talk) 00:35, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * If that is ture and the weapons will be released before hand, the please find the source, because all of those weapons look great. Also if this is released in late August, I'm sure BioWare have their reasons, and to be honest I really don't care as long as it's relaeased before mid-September. As to the surprise, well it would be a very bad idea to ruin it, even hint at what it is before the pack is out. However with BioWare's reputation, it will be a good one. Lancer1289 00:40, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Same here, i want my squad armed to the teeth with these new guns so i can kick the collectors right in the daddy bags as Kenneth Donnelly puts it. Shadowhawk27 00:48, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

It wasn't said that Shadow Broker wouldn't be released until late August, the phrasing and the clearing up by Jarrett Lee implies that we will be seeing some really cool details as we go into August. This could mean LotSB could be anytime from mid-August to eternity. It'll be here When it's Done.--Xaero Dumort 05:30, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Boo! In the immortal words of Homer Simpson, But I want it now! :P SpartHawg948 05:36, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * LOL! You Spart are hilarious! Hehe. I am looking forward to this new DLC. Mmmm, more weapons of destruction! GrandMoffVixen 06:10, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

I try. :) SpartHawg948 06:10, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * (P.S... think that's funny? Just wait till next Sunday. I'll be gone for quite a while, and my instructions on what to do in my absence will be in the form of a sound-bite consisting of one of the most uncharacteristic things Principal Skinner has ever said.) SpartHawg948 06:13, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Does it have anything to do with the Super Nintendo?--Xaero Dumort 18:25, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ah, Super Nintendo Chalmers. No, it doesn't have to do with that, though that is undoubtedly one of Ralph Wiggum's finest lines ever. I'll give one hint- this quote comes from the episode where we find out that the Principal Seymour Skinner we all know and love isn't the real Seymour Skinner, but is actually Armin Tamzarian. SpartHawg948 18:59, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

Who else is going to be dissapointed
I mean we are going to figure out who the shadow broker, is anyone already dissapointed. What i mean is that it will not live up to everyones expectations. . . plus, he will likely be a biped. Also lets hope they dont do what they did with tali. Have liara enter a room, she comes out and says shadow broker is dead. . . . for the love of god lets hope that they actually show the guy WHOEVER HE IS, that way we can have REAL dissatisfaction instead dissatisfaction ultra with cheese. ralok 01:11, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

wait. . . . what did i just type, i cant even like really read what i just typed. Sorry guys for wasting your time, because appearently i had a mental lapse when i typed this thing. ralok 01:15, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

Then next time THINK before you write down what you are going to say bucko Shadowhawk27 03:12, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Wowee! Talk about assumptions! Who said anything about figuring out who the Shadow Broker is? I don't recall anything being mentioned about the SB's identity being revealed in the DLC. SpartHawg948 03:15, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well i on the other hand don't care if it turns out to be a disapointment or not. I just want it for entertainment. Shadowhawk27 03:22, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Indeed. For the life of me I can't understand all the doom-and-gloom pessimism. 'Oh, it's going to be a disappointment'. 'It's got Liara? I don't like her. I won't be downloading it'. 'I'm not going to get it'. Can we at least hold off until it releases to call it a disappointment (or not) or a failure (or not) and to piss and moan about how horrible it is and how 'I won't be getting it'. (And for the record, I most definitely will be getting it). I haven't heard so much prejudicial belly-aching since before the last big election. SpartHawg948 03:25, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * I know many people have had their sheps (Male or female) with Liara as their love interest. But i on the other hand am not worry at all since my shep is not involed with Liara at all. My loyalty is to Ashley and will remain that way till ME3 Shadowhawk27 03:31, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

At what point did i indicate that i was bellyaching. I just said it is going to be dissapointing no matter what happen, and i havent complained about liara once. The point i am making is that no matter who the shadow broker is it is going to be dissapointing in smoe sense, you learn who he is then teh mystery is taken away. If he is killed off screen then it is just sad, if he is a chimpanzee with wires going in and ot of his brian its going to be confusing. No body will be satisfied, its a loose-loose scenario. ralok 07:31, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * And at what point did I indicate it was you who was belly-aching? A simple read of my comment will show my main gripe was with people who already say they'll refuse to even try it for whatever reason. Nor did I ever say you had complained about Liara. Other people have, and those individuals were the ones I was referencing. This is why your name never came up. Not once. SpartHawg948 07:38, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * What I'm hoping for is that the Shadow Broker is not one person, something that was mentioned in the game as a possibility, it's an organisation with few leaders. Makes much more sense. It'd be funny if it ended up being Udina. Setimir92 08:39, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Oh wow! Wouldn't that just be a hoot! :D SpartHawg948 08:48, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * To be honest, i really don't care who the shadow broker is, as long as Liara gets her revenge for what SB did to her in Mass Effect: Redemption, I'm happy. Shadowhawk27 14:02, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * To be honest, i really don't care who the shadow broker is, as long as Liara gets her revenge for what SB did to her in Mass Effect: Redemption, I'm happy. Shadowhawk27 14:02, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

She's after this revenge for a guy she knew all of what, 24 hours? And after 2 years still has at least a small hope, he might be alive and just being tortured? Girl has serious abandonment issues, which I can kinda understand why.--Xaero Dumort 18:28, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

Xaero--if I remember my comic-reading, this fellow also did do a few things to save her life and ensure that she got Shepard's body, not the Collectors. I wouldn't be calling it that if I were you. Aryn2382 18:41, July 25, 2010 (UTC)
 * I think you are thinging of Feron not the Shadow Broker, as the Shadow Broker did just about everything to get Shepard's body to the Collectors. Lancer1289 18:44, July 25, 2010 (UTC)
 * He is thinking of Feron, I assumed as much anyway. And sure he did, but there are plenty of spoiler centric things that he did that negate a few of those things. I'm just saying that someone has to do quite a bit to ensure my loyalty in less then a day. Especially when they went to the hub and she still didn't trust him 100%.--Xaero Dumort 17:33, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

I for one feel that I will not be disappointed as I am happy with all the other DLC I have purchased thus far. GrandMoffVixen 21:07, July 25, 2010 (UTC)

Disappointed?! I'm ecstatic! Liara is one of my favorite characters in the Mass Effect universe so far. As for the shadow broker if any one can make the reveal (if he/she/it/they are even revealed) interesting and well done its Bioware so I'm not worried. I'm hopping against hope (it probably won't happen buy I can dream) that after the conclusion of this dlc liara will become a selectable team mate. So ya you may be disappointed but you do not speak for everyone this is the first ME2 dlc that I have been really excited for and I will be getting first day that its out. Bring it on Shadow Broker!!Argentum vulpes volpes 02:36, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Huzzah! Now that's what I like to see! Some enthusiasm! SpartHawg948 02:47, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * I really wouldn't mind if Liara decided to join your cause after having "dealt" with the Shadow Broker. However, I'm pretty sure this DLC is leaning towards the ME2 -> ME3 tie-in rather than more help for your suicide mission. It also gets me thinking, there's no more room in the squad selection screen... hinting at some dark ending for Liara?


 * Nah, that's not gonna happen. Freakium 04:27, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Theres no reason the squad selection screen couldn't rotate.Argentum vulpes volpes 15:36, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Or that they could do something else, but the problem is that where is Liara going to stay aboard the Normandy? All of the areas are already taken up, so will she stay with another squadmate, in the CIC, cockpit, the Med-bay, or in the Hanger opening that deck up? I would like having Liara back, I did like her in ME, mainly the conversations with her were fun, but she is a powerful biotic and I wouldn't mind another one on the team. Personally I really don't care if she becomes a squadmate but it would also be interesting if you romanced her in ME. Which is probably why Ashley/Kaiden doesn't come with you after Horizon, I'm talking about the scripting of the game not the in-game reason here, as it would defeat the purpose of romance options in ME2 if you completed a romance in ME. Lancer1289 16:01, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't be surprised if there is an Ashley/Kaidan DLC later as well, furthering the link between the two games with DLC like they wanted and starting that whole, "You cheated on me?" dynamic before ME3. The only character I don't think will get a DLC, at least to re-join the squad would be Wrex. This is all assuming that Liara will even join after doing this DLC and starting this chain of DLC.--Xaero Dumort 17:33, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * My best bet that the new weapons pack will be say, 160 Microsoft Points (Xbox 360)/160 Bioware Points (PC) and Lair of the Shadow Broker will also be 560 Microsoft Points (Xbox 360)/560 Bioware Points (PC) too. Shadowhawk27 21:35, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * My best bet that the new weapons pack will be say, 160 Microsoft Points (Xbox 360)/160 Bioware Points (PC) and Lair of the Shadow Broker will also be 560 Microsoft Points (Xbox 360)/560 Bioware Points (PC) too. Shadowhawk27 21:35, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Liara will be joining your squad as a 4th non-playable character
Judging by one of the screenshots, Liara will be joining your squad as a 4th non-playable character. However i heard rumors that if your Commander Shepard cheated on Liara T'Soni during your Mass Effect 2 playthrough, this DLC announcement might trigger a cold sweat. Bioware has also stated that they would be trying to bridge the gap between ME2 and ME3 with DLC content and this could be their first attempts at doing so! Shadowhawk27 23:22, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * I certainly hope that this is the first attempt at bridging the gap! Man, I am excited for this! If it is not here is my reaction GrandMoffVixen 04:57, August 3, 2010 (UTC)


 * I looked at the screenshots on the dlc page and Tali Is on the latest screenshot and i think its Archangels recruitment or Mordins and you cant do any fighting missions after recruiting mordin and garrus and you use to be able to recruit in any order but its new. And This should be a good dlc aslong as we find out if the shadow broker is a man,women a group or an AI. Since people say how the shadow broker does so much at once so maybe its an AI.Commander maddox 20:23, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * I"m pretty sure the screenshot you're talking about (the one with Tali that appears to be on Omega) has nothing to do with Lair of the Shadow Broker. It looks like it's just a screenshot showing off the new guns of the Firepower pack. SpartHawg948 22:04, August 3, 2010(UTC)

Cost
What will the cost be for Xbox? and would the cost be similar to Overlord? Templars1191 23:12, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * Right now the cost appears to be the low, low price of TBA. As for being similar in price to Overlord, that seems like a fairly reasonable guess. SpartHawg948 23:16, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * Indeed it does and it has support. Kasumi and Overlord both cost 560 MS points, and I'm pretty sure Zaeed would have too if he wasn't released via Cerberus network. So the 560 definelty has president and I wouldn't be surprised that when it is released, it will cost 560 MS points. Lancer1289 23:37, August 3, 2010 (UTC)
 * I think i left what the price would be on one of my posts for Liara's DLC Shadowhawk27 12:19, August 4, 2010 (UTC)

Adept Changes
Hardly worth including in the article, but I did want to post it somewhere.

Anyway, Christina Norman (ME2 lead gameplay designer) recently tweeted: "I want shadow broker to come out so I can start my adept insanity playthrough of mass effect 2!"

Which reminded me of this older tweet: "You want us to make the adept more powerful in ME3? Who says we'll wait for ME3?" and "You don't see how adepts can get stronger before ME3? Ok, that's how you see it."

Intriguing. I hope whatever changes are on the cards aren't limited to the Adept, seeing as I play the Infiltrator, not that it matters much since I'm playing DLC post game and any weapons/enhancements or anything will go completely unused until more DLC. JakePT 07:34, August 8, 2010 (UTC)

well whatever doesnt kill you makes you stronger. Shadowhawk27 00:43, August 9, 2010 (UTC)

Release Date sort of confirmed
Rumor has it this is the date for this DLC games.gamepressure.com/game_info.asp Shadowhawk27 23:39, August 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Well its not an official source, but the date is consistent with Xbox Live releases on Tuesday. Since BioWare stated that they would release it by the end of August, we have either the 24th or the 31st. Personally I hope it will be next week, but I won't be surprised if it is the 31st. Lancer1289 01:20, August 18, 2010 (UTC)

I didn't know BioWare said by the end of August. I will personally hope for the 24th as well.--Xaero Dumort 20:50, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yea they said in in a forum post, that I think is linked on this page, or the Talk:Firepower Pack page. I'll see if I can find it, otherwise I'll dive into the forums to find the thing. I shal not rest until I do. I like to keep people informed. Lancer1289 20:53, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm still waiting for the additional information about LotSB that BioWare said they'd give us before it releases. But if it comes out next Tuesday, I won't complain. -- Commdor (Talk) 20:56, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * I know I said I wouldn't give up, but I can't seem to find it. Either the post got really buried in the forums, or I jsut can't find it. Maybe someone else can. Anyway the post stated that we would get more informtaion over the course of August until the release. However they stated that they wouldn't give away plot spoilers. I couldn't find the link curses. Lancer1289 21:20, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * We don’t know if the confrontation will be direct contact with the Broker at all, most likely with one of their proxies. My guess for the DLC would have you visit key places in the Citadel cut off since ME 1, like the chambers of the Consort and the embassies of the non-human races. Maybe check in with Chorban (if you helped him collect all the keeper data). Just an opportunity to bring back a bit more of the original into the mix before the 3rd in the series brings Shepard to retirement. Shadowhawk27 22:52, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Price
Since the price is increased for this DLC pack. Is anyone else curious as to what it will bring. Me personally, I think more missions, than previous packs. That, or its going to have a lot more content. I'm seriously looking forward to it in two weeks. And that's before my 12 week classes begin so I can write the walkthoguhs. Lancer1289 17:19, August 23, 2010 (UTC)

I think it will be a bigger/more significant DLC pack and I'm excited about that. I'm very curious to see how the Liara romance stuff will go....as in, what might happen if you bring your ME2 romance with you. And of course, I'm just hoping that I get my Xbox back from Microsoft by the time the DLC comes out. Stupid red ring of death....grrrr...... biscuitmix 18:59, August 23, 2010 (UTC)

Well some of you may have school life on your end, i on the other hand am not too concern with school, No more pencils, No more books and No more teacher's dirty looks, LOL (does the victory dance while the crowd cheers). However i will be busy moving to another house so by the time sept 7 strikes, i'll be ready.... Shadowhawk27 20:38, August 23, 2010 (UTC)

New weapon (new research)? What do you think?
I found something (I think) interesting in this screenshot. When I first saw the (two handed) weapon Shepard holds, I thought it was the Scimitar. So I edited a bit the photo and made it a bit brighter, just to be sure, and I found that its not the Scimitar. I dont think that its an assault rifle neither a sniper rifle, because both of them can be seen on Shepards back. Neither a pistol cause one is already at Shepards side.

I think its either a (new) shotgun or a (new) heavy weapon. It resembles an M-22 Eviscerator and the colors look like it but its not because the shape doesnt match the M-22.

I made an image to compare the weapons that are already available and that one in the screenshot.

Here it is (warning 2000x1150 image) : Lair of the Shadow Broker Screenshot

I excluded the Collector Assault Rifle, the Geth Pulse Rifle, the Collector Particle Beam and the Geth Plasma Shotgun because its obvious that its neither of them for sure.

So, opinions?


 * I think it looks like the M-23 Katana myself. I'd like to be wrong, if only for the sake of getting a new weapon. The more the merrier. -- Commdor (Talk) 19:30, August 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * I agree... Looks like the Katana. Tanooki1432 19:35, August 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * After looking at it, I don't think its any weapon avaliable currently. From what I can see, I think it says X96 or X94 on the side of the weapon, but I don't think it matches the writing on the Katana. I think it is another gun, because it doesn't look like anything we currenlty have, then I'm all for that. If we see it later, then that's fine too. I was hoping for a new sniper rifle though. NowI will admit that it does look like the Katana, but me, I think its different. The stock looks different and so do the paint lines. Lancer1289 19:44, August 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * Just looks like a poorly lit Katana to me. I don't know how you can even make out any writing on the thing. -- Dammej ( talk ) 20:06, August 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * It's clearly the Katana, everything is in exactly the right place.JakePT 12:53, August 24, 2010 (UTC)

Romance Continuation With Liara
Regarding the point where an ME1 romance with Liara can be continued during this DLC, does it mention WHEN it can be done? I currently have 2 characters in ME2, and I want to know whether or not I'd be able to continue this if my character already consummated a relationship with a ME2 character. If so, then I'd be able to use my first character (Femshep, beaten the game, consummated with Jacob) to do this. If not, then I'd have to use another of my ME1 characters who romanced Liara to do so. H-Man Havoc 20:50, August 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * There is currenlty little information on it. I guess we will have to wait and see. However it probably works along the same lines as the others, if the picture is down, then you probably can't. That's just my opinion on this, we'll just have to wait two weeks and see. Lancer1289 20:55, August 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * So worst case scenario I'd have to import my original ME2 character. Good thing the romances don't carry over when a character is re-imported.H-Man Havoc 23:02, August 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * I was originally going to have my Shep with Liara, but after seeing Evil Aliens (2006), a British "splatstick" horror-comedy film with one scene which i will not go into details made me decide againest the pairing.... Shadowhawk27 23:41, August 23, 2010 (UTC)

Realy what scene was that

Sorry. out--Legionwrex 01:48, August 24, 2010 (UTC)

You have to watch the movie in order to find out what i was refering to Legionwrex Shadowhawk27 12:26, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

Liara's new look in LOTSB
Although i like the new liara better than the old one. i cant help but look at her neck and think.. reptilian.. is bioware hinting at something here? all in all though the new face texture is a huge improvement over the old. I think BioWare just updated her look, possibly grittier to show the effect of all the exploits she's been though.


 * I'm not sure what is it about her neck that looks "reptilian" but it looks pretty similar to her in ME. Other than that, she looks more detailed but still has the same physical appearance. The change in her skin colour could be due to ambient lighting. — Teugene (Talk) 03:39, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I don't see anything reptilian either. She looks pretty much the same as every other asari does in ME2. Really, she just had her appearance updated from ME to ME2. I don't see any real difference between Liara in LOTSB and Liara on Illium. SpartHawg948 04:11, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Indeed I don't see anything either. I think the change is just BioWare updating her appearence. Lancer1289 04:21, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * The only thing I notice is that she looks more gray than blue in the LotSB picture, but that's probably just ambient lighting. It's rather neat what the lighting and shadows can do to my caucasian chick Shep. If you're referring to the (for lack of a better term) "creases" on her neck towards the back, that's present on all Asari. It just hasn't really been visible on Liara because she's always been wearing shirts with high necks. Tanooki1432 12:26, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok what aout her lips? Notice any difference? Shadowhawk27 12:44, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Differnt color of makeup perhaps. Otherwise that may be somethat that happens to asari as they get older, or are getting older under stress. Like how humans sometimes get gray hair from stress. Lancer1289 12:49, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * It's a new texture, otherwise she looks exactly the same. She only looks different because ME1 had a comparatively low-res skin.JakePT 12:50, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Another possiblility, though this is a longshot since she's still comparitively young, is she passed into the Maiden Stage. (She's 109 now, I would think the Matron Stage hits around 300, though we don't know asari too well to make that definite) Shadowhawk27 12:54, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * She already is a Maiden... It's basically from birth to 350ish. Tanooki1432 13:22, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Maybe she has the "Shiala Syndrome" :P SoulRipper 13:15, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, although the Matron stage is defined as being older than 350, it can be achieved earlier if an Asari maiden melded more frequently than normal, though Liara isn't the type to meld at a high rate. H-Man Havoc 18:43, August 24, 2010 (UTC)
 * I play mostly as a femShep and one of the first things I do when I enter the Normandy is changing her default uniform for the cientific one, the same as Dr. Chakwas. The reson is simple: Bioware really made a shitty work in Shepard's animation, both male and female BTW. femShep also has a neck of a camel-bird! WTF Bioware was thinking I really don't know, but they seriouslly screwed up her. The diference you see in the "new" Liara is her neck is not covered, like Tanooki1432 pointed. Brfritos 05:31, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

My guess on the new stuff
Here's what i think the new 5 achievements will be:

1. Fleeting Shadow- Founded the Shadowbroker Base

2. Breaking the Broker- Defeated/Killed the Shadowbroker

3. Loyal Love- Continued the Relationship with Liara

4. Gathering Info- Collected X amount of Collection Items in LotSB

5. Just Like Old Times- Brought Garrus and/or Tali for the mission

also Chris Priestly wrote, "I know I am not supposed to give away secrets in the game, but here it goes. And I promise you that is 100% true. Now never say I don't tell you stuff." The Shadowbroker is...

a) A Salarian

b) A Volus

C) Conrad Verner

D) An Asari

E) Something or someone else Shadowhawk27 23:39, August 25, 2010 (UTC)
 * The Liara one wouldn't happen because not everyone have a relationship with her and I'm not about to replay ME to get one ME2 achievement.--Xaero Dumort 03:04, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * You can edit the Coalesced that makes the game think you had the romance with Liara in order to get the achievement. Shadowhawk27 12:01, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Loyal love achievement wouldn't just cover Liara. I think if they add that, it'll also cover other ME1 romance options, and future DLC would allow you to earn it as well. Tanooki1432 12:16, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Like i said, You can edit the Coalesced that lets you get all the achievements. Shadowhawk27 12:25, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Meh. If the achievement even exists, and I don't get it, meh. I won't lose much sleep over it. Tanooki1432 12:38, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm reminded of an old Philosopher who once said, "No one is forced to use it. Your game, your choice." Shadowhawk27 12:55, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

Not everyone plays ME or ME2 on PC. It's a point of pride for me and my love of Mass Effect to have every achievement in each game. BioWare knows better, there's a reason that Paramour in ME applied to any romance. Heck it'll probably be just another way to get that achievement in ME2 if you chose not to experiment with any new romance. Dragon Age did it differently because it was possible to get three/four in one play and they don't carry to DA2 in any continuing romance.--Xaero Dumort 18:21, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

Okay so the Shadow Broker is one of four people (or all of the above) but seriously? Conrad Verner? I wouldn't imagine him being the Shadow Broker although I wouldn't be surprised if he turned out to be the Shadow Broker, since he'd be the last person to expect. That would be funny actually. Where did you hear this?174.3.9.125 00:53, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

i think conrad verner was put in as a joke.Soul reaper magnum 02:02, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

Who else hopes for research balancing?
Something that has always bothered me was the either/or research gain from Zaeed's loyalty mission. Paragon for heavy weapons or Renegade for assault rifles. I always hope that one of theses DLCs balances that out by offering a reverse Para = assault, Rene = heavy. Doesn't necessarily have to be that way either, just present us with the choice, pick one or the other, that way if it doesn't bother anyone else they can have a 200% Cain without a heavy weapons armor pack.--Xaero Dumort 03:02, August 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * True, but should this mission take place after the Suicide Mission (and by that, I mean it can only be started AFTER the Suicide Mission - as part of the bridge between ME2 and ME3 -, though I wouldn't know anything about that yet), it's really a moot point. Prismvg 12:14, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well then why offer new research at all with that mentality? And there's a good chance that nothing big changes gameplay wise and ME3 is going to be a direct continuation. I wouldn't be surprised if you start ME3 at level 30, sort of like an expansion.--Xaero Dumort 18:23, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm trying to find an appropiate answer but I get stuck figuring out what mentality you are referring to. The one where I say that this could be playable only after the Suicide Mission or the one where I say it doesn't really matter what kind of research we get from this mission IF it's played after the epilogue? 'Cause that stuff with ME3 being a direct expansion has nothing to do with what I said. Prismvg 18:32, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, I meant the mentality of being only available after the Suicide Mission. There would be no point to having the new research they announced in game at all if it was only available after the main story. And yes it does have everything to do with what you said. It wouldn't be moot to have that research option if everything carried into ME3 if the mission was only available after the end of the main story. I should have been more clear in what I was getting at. IF everything carried over into ME3 then having new research from a mission that only took place after the ME2 main plot would not be moot. But of course the entirety of this discussion is all based on pure speculation and conjecture.--Xaero Dumort 18:56, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

My point was based on the fact that abilities, items, research and such wouldn't carry over - though it's hard to find a another good pretext for that, after all the dying/resurrecting and everything. For me, gameplay-wise, ME2 is over, but story-wise, it's not, and that's why I'd like this dlc's content to take place after the SM, for the sake of continuing the story (like Witch Hunt will do). The DLC's released so far have no contribution in that regard, and maybe it's time for a change. Prismvg 19:08, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * Fair point, I see what you are saying. Some of that would be nice, and one can hope that we will see some like that as we head closer to an ME3 release.--Xaero Dumort 00:51, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

4th non-playable charachter?
I read it in a previous comment. What is that means?? She will just stand somewhere in the ship, like Dr. chakwas, joker and EDI?

I'm not sure... You do get to play as Joker for his 15 mins of fame to save Normandy, but apart form that you are basically stuck on Shep. So its possible, we will have to wait and seeTj2592 13:21, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

Propably, during the mission(s) of the DLC, you will have your squad and Liara will be with you, as a 4th squad member. She will fire against enemies but you will not be able to control her, like giving directions and use biotic powers etc.SoulRipper 13:50, August 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * Maybe she'll actually be a permanent squadmember. That would be nice and could further pave the way to ME3. Side note: I hope if that's the case, then in ME3 we get the ability to drag one more squadmate around... We have too many squadmates for the number we're allowed to drag along. Tanooki1432 14:05, August 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * Judging by the unlocked dialogue that started the rumor this DLC was planned, it is more likely Liara returns to Illium after the mission. As a 4 squad member she is AI controlled but not subject to your orders and cannot be upgraded. And I doubt she will appear on the Normandy. More likely, if you do need to travel by the Normandy, the game just jumps you to the destination. Plus, once the mission is over, a romance cutscene is played on the way back. If you did not romance Liara, you simply don’t get the cutscene. Ironreaper 14:45, August 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * Youtube can always provide the cutscene for those who didn't have a romance with Liara :P Shadowhawk27 21:41, August 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * Dude u hav a dirty mind.... High fiveTj2592 22:26, August 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * Back at ya buddy, I on the other hand am not too concern with the romance with liara since my loyality is to Ashley and will remain that way till ME3. If Feron Liara's drell friend who got left behind with Shadow Broker's people is in the game i'm willing to bet Tazzik will show up as part of a boss fight. Shadowhawk27 23:27, August 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * I think that Feron ate some grenades from Tazziks grenade launcher when he left behind.SoulRipper 08:38, August 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * Then Tazzik will like a M-98 Widow round through his head....Tj2592 13:34, August 28, 2010 (UTC)
 * Thats the spirit :P SoulRipper 17:01, August 28, 2010 (UTC)