Talk:Ashley Williams

What is the source of that e-mail quoted at length in the main article? I do not recall seeing it in the game. 209.195.164.34 23:42, January 29, 2010 (UTC)

Ash and Shepard reminisce?

"She is amazed that she and Shepard went to the same training facility and they can reminisce about getting yelled at by Gunnery Chief Ellison." Does this dialog actually happen in the game? If so, where exactly do you get this dialog? And do you have to have a specific pre-history?
 * When Ash asks why Shepard joined the Alliance, if Shepard says it was 'to see space', Ashley is reminded of her first trip to Titan and mentions her DI telling her off for goldbricking. If Shepard picks up on 'goldbricking', the commander remembers hearing that when Ellison thinks someone is shirking duty, and Ash can't believe she went to the same boot camp. I've had this dialogue with a female Shepard: a male might get a different response. --Tullis 22:30, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

I think you can get it on any profile and I got it with the defult male Sherperd and the defult female Sheperd so thats what I think once I get my Xbox fixed I will find out.Troy 027 03:54, 24 August 2008 (UTC) Troy 027

Ash's sisters
Do we want to do separate articles for Ash's sisters? We have enough for a decent article on Sarah (thanks to Ashley's loooong story and other bits) but, not sure about the others. Though I suppose we have an article for Shepard's mother and that's hardly any size. Thoughts? --Tullis 14:14, 4 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Sounds good, maybe do a general page for Ashley's sisters (if we have anything to write about any of them) and just add as we go along... --silverstrike 15:57, 4 February 2009 (UTC)


 * About all that's said about Abby and Lynn is that the former is a ren faire girl ("likes waving swords around" and wears "tops you have to tie yourself into") and the latter is a bit nervous. Stormwaltz 20:46, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

Anti-xenophobia convincing?
Huh. I think I just managed to convince Ash to be less xenophobic. Male Shephard, 10 Charm, after the discussion where she tells him about his grandfather, pick the option "The alliance is right". Almost makes me sorry she won't be seeing Ilos.

Here,in Mass Effect wiki says interesting things about Kaiden and Ashley(about their false death on Virmire)...It says that BioWare provided Ashley/Kaiden does not die on Virmire....That´s good,isn´t???


 * Well, hate to say it, but I have no clue what you are talking about, mostly as a result of the broken english. No idea what "false death" is being referred to (one of them DID die, nothing false about it), so I'm gonna take a stab at it. The only thing I can think of that comes close to what you are saying is that BioWare confirmed that Ashley and Kaiden do make appearances provided they did not die on Virmire. What that means is that only one of them will appear in each playthrough, as the other died in the previous game, but it is possible to see them both in the game, just on different playthroughs. Import a game where Ashley died on Virmire, and Kaidan appears, not Ashley. Import a game where Kaidan died on Virmire and you get Ashley. Pretty straightforward. SpartHawg948 22:39, December 18, 2009 (UTC)

Why was this interesting tidbit removed?
I added this (included below) but was removed by a later editor. It was an interesting tidbit referring to gaming culture. Care to elaborate why, seeing as - in comparison - Urdnot Wrex's trivia contained speculation and subjective statement such as "fan favorite", whereas this is fact? Liara's trivia section also contain trivia in similar nature to below:

"When the player first meets Lorik Qui'in, upon inquiry of Matriarch Benezia and asking him if it was odd to see a matriarch, Lorik would comment that "An asari in a pinstriped suit set tongues wagging among the younger male employees..". If the player has Ashley in the squad at the time, she would interject with, "Young men have funny ideas of what asari are like. I blame the extranet. And computer games."

We can have a "Quotes" section and place the her quote there, since we [i]are[/i] quoting things. It's really discouraging when the point of the wiki is for everyone to contribute, but for a contributor to have his contribution edited out wholesale. If I took time out of my life to write that, the least one could do is take the time to make a Quote section to place it. 208.120.25.229 9:39 PM, January 31st, 2010 (EST)


 * I would say it was probably removed because it's totally irrelevant... I mean sure, it's a cute punch line... It's just not relevant to her character and it doesn't tell us anything about what she's like. JakeARoonie 03:25, March 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * Indeed. And while the info on Wrex has been documented in other locations (such as the Official XBox Magazine, where he was named best sidekick), the one-off line from Williams is just that. A one-off line. No more or less notable than any of the other one-off lines uttered by any of the other characters, and as pointed out above, not indicative of her character in any way. SpartHawg948 04:30, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

Ashley in Mass Effect 2 *SPOILERS*
I have to say, it was a double-edged sword that Ashley, or any of the other romances from Mass Effect 1, had such a small role in Mass Effect 2. She was one of the characters I really dug into in ME1, and really fit as a good romance for the character role I chose for Shepard -- she was smart, tough, beautiful, cleverly flawed and stubborn, but had her heart in the right place; she just, for me, represented everything a woman should be. By the first scene of ME2, I had realized that I actually missed this girl, and I was excited to see how her and Shepard would reconnect after his resurrection. The subsequent confrontation in the Horizon colony left me a bit angry. At first, I thought, "Really? That's just it? Was this BioWare's way of just phasing the character out to clear the slate for new romances -- where's the depth in that?" I have faith that Drew Karpyshyn does better writing than that. I withdrew from having Shepard romance any of the other characters, not just out of spite, but because it seemed shallow of him -- none of them really fit the character role he played as a Paragon. Tali comes close, I love her character, but as a romance option it just didn't quite fit into place. They certainly made Miranda into eye candy, but I like to think of the Mass Effect series as a TV series or movie trilogy -- if I was watching it, what would I think of Shepard's character if he went after every piece of eye candy available? I try to keep him true to his character role... flaws make the character interesting, but having him stray into another romance just for shits and giggles didn't really make for a believable Paragon Shepard, or a likeable character.

Then came the scene where Shepard smiles at Ashley's photo at the end -- what a rewarding scene that was -- and it put a lot of things into perspective for me. Mass Effect is all about making tough choices -- and some of these choices have unforseeable consequences. Some good, some bad, some niether. It's my belief -- or my hope, rather -- that there is a rewarding consequence for those who choose to stay faithful, or not, to the romance from ME1. Even if it makes Mass Effect 3 consist of the three disks, and takes much longer before release, I really hope that this is their intention. I can live without Ashley being a party member; what I really want is significantly more interaction, dialogue, development and depth between these characters that brings a believable sense of continuation, or closure, in their relationship.

If that's what is to come in Mass Effect 3, I believe the interaction in ME2 is brilliant. I'm sure BioWare realizes that the interaction with ME1's romance in ME2 will leave many players wanting more, and they plan to reward them in ME3. Otherwise, shame on you BioWare, what a wonderful character to cut out of the cast. MerrellJ 15:06, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

Note that the framed picture on the desk in your private quarters likely depends on your romance history in ME1. I personally had one of Liara, with whom I had developped a relationship in ME1.Celorilm 15:13, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

Shortly after your encounter with Ashley on Horizon, she sends an email to you apologizing for the way she acted. She also tells you she doesn't want to lose you again in the email. She'll be back in ME3, The devs stated that the Romance is told accross the trilogy, so I'm sure good things are to come for those of us who stayed loyal to Ash. Lord Saren101 18:19, February 1, 2010 (UTC)

If you cheat on you Mass effect love interest with a new one, then youll probably be confronted over it in ME3. With that in mind, I have to say if you cheated on Ash with Jack, then you'll probably be in for the most awkward and potentially dangerous situation of the games. Both will gladly kill you if you piss them off enough.

Something important to tell him?
In the romance cutscene of Mass Effect 1, Ashley says that she has something important to tell Shepard, but tells him that he'll have to come back to her after surviving Illos to hear it. Is it ever discovered what she had to say? I believe she wanted to tell Shepard that she loved him, but decided to tease him for it. Still, I was curious if there was a confirmed answer on this. Obsessed? No... of course not... but Ashley is going to have my babies in ME3. *pause* Just don't tell my wife. MerrellJ 15:20, February 3, 2010 (UTC)

I think what she wanted to tell him was indeed that she loved him. But Ashley being Ashley decided to tease. I think we may have to throw down my friend because Ashley is already pledged to me :P Lord Saren101 17:27, February 3, 2010 (UTC)

Ashley is all of a sudden a bugger-lover? (semi-spoilers)
Sorry, Ashley-lovers, but did anyone else find it weird that the message in ME2 regarding her death quoted her as being all buddy-buddy with alien crewmembers? Ashley was a huge xenephobe- the evidence of her gladly going into battle alongside aliens is crap when she's already said she'd do that if that's what Shepard ordered. It's especially notable in my game where I played a girl who was all up on the blue chick, so I had to verbally backhand Ash a little extra. I can give some sympathy to Presley, since there's some actual evidence of his opinion changing (even if it does show Bioware whitewashing humans again). Ashley, though, was still a massive xenophobe in my game and I demanded she button her lip every time I spoke to her. Now all of a sudden she's lovingly remembered as a cool dude. I'm not happy with that. Revdrkevind 18:05, February 19, 2010 (UTC)

Depending upon your interactions and conversation choices with Ash in ME 1, it was possible to turn her from Xenophobic, to very accepting and comfortable with the Alien races. So much to the point where if taken for the final mission she recommends you save the council.Lord Saren101 19:42, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yet when you met her on Horizon in ME2 and have the long talk with her. you ask her to join you she'll refuse and say that she's not a fan of aliens. Shadowhawk27 21:02, October 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * True, that was a little confusing. Though she did seem even more wary of Cerberus, so perhaps she's just distrustful of everyone due to recent events. EDIT: To clarify, Cerberus was just an example of humans whom she distrusted even more than aliens, alluding to her current state of mind. She obviously would already be skeptical of Cerberus due to events in ME1. Ev0lve 21:08, October 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Even when Bringing Garrus and Tali along, Ashley will still feel betrayed that her former Teammates have joined the Enemy of the Alliance.Shadowhawk27 21:23, October 4, 2010 (UTC)

I'm impressed that you brought Tali to Horizon (/wink). I do feel that whichever writer crafted that conversation could have done a much, much better job. Ashley's character on the whole is still one of my favorites, though, so I tend to gloss over these hiccups. Ev0lve 21:25, October 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) So does Kaidan. GASP! Does that mean Kaidan is a xenophobe too? Or merely that both of them express surprise that so many people they thought they knew would now be working with an unscrupulous group like Cerberus? SpartHawg948 21:26, October 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Exactly! If you put yourself in her shoes (or Kaidan's, if that's the path you chose), it doesn't seem far-fetched that you would feel betrayed on a number of levels. Shepard shows up after being "dead" for two years, and the first she sees of him is that he's working with a group that they fought against together and is now rumored to be one of the suspects behind the colony disappearances. Ev0lve 21:34, October 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * I forgot to mention, the only way you can bring Tali to Horizon is by using the Gibbed save editor. Shadowhawk27 21:37, October 4, 2010 (UTC)

Tennyson = Babylon 5 reference?
Firstly, I apologize for making an edit before submitting this for discussion. If this proves problematic, I will undo the edit.

I was just wondering, does anyone here think that Ashley's quoting of Tennyson may be a subtle nod to Babylon 5? I ask because Ulysses was recited twice in the show-- first in the very first episode, and again in episode 405, and both times by the commanding officer. Is this significant enough for inclusion, or should it be dropped?

Some quick references:

http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/guide/071.html

http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/making/literary.html

SuperLoNC 21:54, February 20, 2010 (UTC)


 * Can you provide the context in which it was used? So far you've pointed out that it was used twice in B5, which, were some more similarities present, would merit inclusion, although you also pointed out that both times it was recited by the Commanding Officer (which actually differentiates the two, so not sure why it was mentioned). So basically, if you can provide contextual similarities then sure, it can be included. Also, wasn't it quoted three times in the series? I believe it was quoted twice in Season 1. SpartHawg948 23:10, February 20, 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm all for including references, but I think Tennyson is more of a Tennyson reference. ;) For example if Rush Limbaugh recites Tennyson on his show and then I recite Tennyson later, it doesn't mean I'm making a reference to Limbaugh. Just means we're Tennyson fans. :P JakeARoonie 03:21, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

I'd say there's a fair chance it's a B5 reference, but not so much because parts of the poem was recited on B5 as well as ME rather than they both had a military officer with a mild obsession with the piece (Ash's father and Sinclair.) It was indeed quoted again in season three, this time by Sheridan remembering a note left on his desk when he first arrived (the implication being it was left by Sinclair.) Given how many other B5 references there are in ME, it seams likely that this was an intentional reference. 86.4.177.115 22:19, September 15, 2010 (UTC)

Ashley's eyes
Am I the only one who thinks maybe Ash has lazy eye? Admittedly it would be a strange thing to include in a videogame, and all throughout ME1 I noticed how her eyes didn't seem to both aim in quite the same place...I thought it was a glitch, but no other characters seem to have that problem, and she does it again in ME2 (though more subtle). Insert joke about her aiming skills here. But really, just wondering if anyone else noticed this. JakeARoonie 16:44, March 20, 2010 (UTC)

Indeed. It does seem her one eye is a little off. I noticed that too. It could be a glitch, but there wasn't enough time with her in ME2 to see if it continued into the sequel. An interesting thought, otherwise. 131.44.1.69 11:43, March 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's a glitch. Something like that would generally keep someone from being admitted into the military, and it would certianly prevent them from leading the exemplary career Chief Williams has led. SpartHawg948 19:43, March 22, 2010 (UTC)

Edit of Ashley page.
As I was half-way doing an edit of the article, I've noticed a large chunk of information - specifically under the personal file section - is rather out of place, only to realize after checking the history that the details is Bioware's official information. Having said that, I took the liberty to try and rewrite those details into the article proper (and placed any remaining information that don't belong anywhere under trivia) so as it would have a smoother flow and train of thought, but I'm not sure if anyone else would agree having official Bioware information being torn apart! It might be considered sacrilegious to some! LOL. Thus, I have not applied any changes to this page yet, instead, the edited article it in my sandbox, so I can get feedback on the proposed edit. The purpose of the edit is to ensure consistency of this article with other pages. It isn't perfect but at least I tried and hopefully the feedback will help improve things. The page can be found here. Thanks for the feedback. 11:00, March 26, 2010 (UTC)

Ashley's Likeness?
I forget which one, but in one of the "making of" videos for Mass Effect, I recall a segment where the character animators @ Bioware are talking about animating Ashely Williams. On the guy's desktop there was a picture of a woman, although it was only a 1 sec flash but I do remember that woman looked like Ashely Williams. So I'm gonna assume that Ashely's likeness is from somewhere? Does anyone know who Ashely William's face is based on? Ubcphysicsyangbo 05:50, May 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Nope. The only ME character I recall being specifically modeled after an actual person is Liara T'Soni. And, given that it was a one-second flash which nobody mentioned even though a segment about animating Ashley Williams would have been the perfect time to do so, I see no need to assume that the person on the desktop was a model for Williams. It could have been the guys wife, or sweetheart, or sister. No need to jump to conclusions here. SpartHawg948 06:06, May 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Oh yeah know I know what you mean, it may have even been just a photoshoped face or something, but I'm just wondering that's all. It would be cool if there was some chick that looked like Ashely though...Ubcphysicsyangbo 07:13, May 22, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ashley is voiced by Kimberly Brookes. And she kinda looks like her in real life. Go compare and judge- http://ui01.gamespot.com/1760/picture4a_2.png That's what I think anyways. Eddo36 04:09, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * We can't use visual comparisons as fact. We only know that Liara and Miranda are based off real people, IIRC, so unless we have devconfirmation, we shouldn't add it. Lancer1289 04:18, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Oh definitely I'm not about to add any non-canon stuff, that's why I posed the question here :) Ubcphysicsyangbo 09:22, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * I had no doubt that you wouldn't have added it. The only reason I commented is the Eddo36 made a statement and it seemed like he would. I knew you wouldn't, but I had to make sure he didn't. Lancer1289 17:19, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * I had no doubt that you wouldn't have added it. The only reason I commented is the Eddo36 made a statement and it seemed like he would. I knew you wouldn't, but I had to make sure he didn't. Lancer1289 17:19, May 29, 2010 (UTC)

Ashley's Military Vocational Code in ME2
She was B4 in ME1, when she was Gunnery Chief. Now she's Operations Chief in ME2, I'm sure her expertise increased as well. Can we make a note that her "B4" only applies to ME1 for all we know? Eddo36 04:06, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well we don't know if B4 is still her vocational code. We don't know the Alliance's naval vocational code system, so again we don't know and that is speculation. And yes I know how military vocational codes work, just as a note. Lancer1289 04:10, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, I'm just saying that the Trivia section in this page says that her MVC is B4. I'm just wondering if a note should be made that it only applied to ME1. Eddo36 04:15, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * No, because again we don't know if it only applies to ME. Adding a note like that would be speculation and that isn't allowed. Lancer1289 04:17, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * No, because again we don't know if it only applies to ME. Adding a note like that would be speculation and that isn't allowed. Lancer1289 04:17, May 29, 2010 (UTC)

We have no idea how Systems Alliance Vocational codes work. As such, there is no reason to assume it would change with a rank or 'expertise' increase. If their system operates anything like the system I'm used to (the USAF's AFSC system), a rank increase wouldn't change her code at all. SpartHawg948 04:41, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, there's no reason to assume it wouldn't change either. It's unknown if it's the same in ME2 as in ME. Why not make a note stating that we don't know if it's still B4? That's what's done for the Collector Cruiser article in referencing the final collector ship encounter. Despite a line of dialogue from joker implying that it's the same cruiser, there's a note that we don't know (And rightly so. He doesn't know either.) What's the harm of a similar note here? Dammej 05:42, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Again we don't know that it changed and until we know differently, a note saying we don't know just wouldn't do either. If we do here then we should put a note on Shepard's page saying that we don't know if his vocational code is also still N7 or not. Putting a note either way just don't cut it, because I didn't see a problem with it before this came up. Lancer1289 05:47, May 29, 2010 (UTC)

please don't yell at me! Well, Shepard hasn't done anything in the alliance since he, uh, died, but Ashley has. I'm not saying anything drastic, just:

''According to Bioware's official data, Ashley's Military Vocational Code is B4 and her Blood Type is B-Positive. She had received genetic enhancements including in-utero vision correction (maternal predisposition for nearsightedness) and Class-B Alliance Infantry Upgrade Package. It's unknown if her MVC is still B4 in Mass Effect 2''

If not, it's cool. But they way it's worded now implies that it -definitely- is B4 during Mass Effect 2, which may not be true. Dammej 05:52, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * How about we just leave it as is. I still don't know why this came up, but I don't see why the current version is bad becuase it eliminates speculation. Because we don't know let's not speculate either way. We know what it is in ME, and as Spart, who is in the military, said that he couldn't see why it would change and I agree. Let's just leave it as is because we can argue about this until the cows come home, and still end up in the same place, we don't know. Also to so a small use <> instead of []. Lancer1289 05:58, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Gah. I knew I should have done a preview. *shakefist* Wiki markuuuuuuppp! Alright. I'll drop it. Dammej 06:04, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Also, on Bioware's website still retains it as B4 despite ME2 had released for a good 4-5 months. So, there's no reason for it to change yet unless we have new information. Teugene 06:08, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Let's just leave it as is,and I am still trying to figure out why this came up in the first place. Lancer1289 06:12, May 29, 2010 (UTC)

Not that I doubt you, but where is this page on Bioware's website? I'm curious what else they have. Dammej 06:15, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Here is the link to the ME page: Mass Effect Home Page. This is the home page, click Galactic Codex, then scroll down and select Ashley. Or just click here: Ash's Page. Lancer1289 06:19, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ah, you beat me to it Lancer! :D Teugene 06:22, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Sorry fast typer. Lancer1289 06:24, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ah, I see. Unfortunate that they don't seem to be as involved anymore, keeping a "galactic codex" on their website with ME2. Ah well, guess that's what this site is for. Dammej 06:32, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Indeed that is what we are here for. That is also why I emailed BioWare to add us to their list of Unofficial wikis. The Dragon Age Wiki is on there, so I saw no reason why we shouldn't be. Lancer1289 06:36, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well just saying that in general, the codexes on the ME1 page should be considered obsolete. They simply haven't updated any since ME1. I'm not just talking about Ashley's page, but in general of all the codexes there. Example- they didn't say Nihlus and Saren are dead on their page, the Normandy hasn't been destroyed, Mass Effect: Ascension is listed as "new". Like the old forums on their page, it's still there but all locked, since they moved their boards to social. Eddo36 22:02, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * That doesn't mean anything. And why would they change it, the ME seciton of BioWare's website, just like our opening paragraphs for any of our ME articles, is written from that perspecitive. It would be a spoiler if they did rewrite them, just like here. Also why should they be considered obsolete. If we take them as obsolete, then let's remove all the info about Ash that was from that site, because it is no longer relevant. And ever other page with info from the BioWare site while we are at it because they are obsolete. Yea, I don't think so. It would be removal of valid content. We haven't learned anything new and as Spart, who is in the US military, USAF, it probably wouldn't change. We don't know so we leave it as is, until we know something different or there is a new update. Again I am still trying to figure out why this was even brought up in the first place. Lancer1289 23:33, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Addendum: ALso if we changed the opening paragraph of the SSV Normandy article to say whyere what it was destroyed, that is one of the largest ME2 spoilers. The same thing applies to the Saren and Nihlus Kryik articles. Putting that they are dead pre massive plot spoliers and it shouldn't be changed. Taking aht info and making it obsolete, we would have to remove all info from each and every article that had info from those entries, as it would be no longer relevant. That isn't going to happen, and those entires are still valid. Lancer1289 23:41, May 29, 2010 (UTC)

You seem to be getting worked up over this. I don't understand why. It would just a tiny note that we would say we don't know if her MVC changed in the two years time between the events of ME and ME2, and would obviously only be placed after the Mass Effect 2 information. I personally don't think it would be that big of a deal to leave a note there.

As to why this came up in the first place: Why does any issue on a wiki get brought up? Someone sees something that they feel might be wrong, so they either change it or bring it up. Not everyone thinks of things immediately. It's why I was able to upload more images from the game the other day. I noticed they were missing from the article, so I uploaded them. Similarly, someone noticed that nothing has been said about her MVC possibly changing in ME2, so they brought it up.

I doubt very much that Eddo was suggesting we remove all information that comes from Mass Effect. You're taking his valid comment that Codex website is out-of-date way out of proportion. It's true. The fact that the Codex is out-of-date has allowed us to update the articles on Saren and Nihlus Kryik to later include information that they've died. This information occurs after a spoiler tag, just as any other plot-revealing note would. I suggest you start assuming people are making comments in good faith instead of immediately categorizing everything they say as an awful idea. Dammej 00:15, May 30, 2010 (UTC)

Addendum: I apologize if that comes off as combative. I've just seen several of your comments being needlessly dismissive of suggestions from other users. I realize that you have poured a lot of time and edits into the wiki, and I wouldn't count that against you. But you have to remember that people other than yourself have good ideas as well. That's all I mean to say. Dammej 00:37, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * (edit confilt) No I'm not getting worked up over it, no need to worry about that. However a note is just speculation becuase again we can't prove it one way or another. A note would just be specualtion, and I don't know how many times I have removed edits that say "well we just don't know for certain.", or something along those lines. If we don't know then why even say anything about it all together, because usually someone starts a debate just like this. A note would just be speculation either way because again we don't if it has or hasn't. However we again don't know how the vocational code system of the Alliance Navy works, and with Spart said earlier, two years and a promotion doesn't necessary mean her code would have been changed. Again we don't know either way so I really don't see a problem with it the way it is.
 * Also I do assume that people are making comments on good faith however when I saw, "the codexes on the ME1 page should be considered obsolete", in my head, I saw that we should consider all of that information on the ME site obsolete, when it isn't. The information is still very valid and unless we have an update on Ash's status, we shouldn't guess if her vocational code has been changed or not. Unfortunatly we all fall victim to assume different things and that is what I saw. You saw something different and commented on that. Lancer1289 00:43, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * To respond to Dammej's addendum,: I do see it as a little combative, however you are making a point, and I prefer people who acutally say what is on their mind. I know that some of my responses have been combative, but so have Spart's and many others, but some people make asumptions about our policies, then edit, and then complain when it gets reverted. I do realize that people have good ideas, and any and all are welcome. I don't enforce my agenda on this site, nor does anyone else. I simply uphold our policies, as does everyone else, and this one does fall under speculation. I am stating my opinion and that is all. I see somehitng good or even great in some cases, I leave it, becuase it is good and in some cases needed. If an edit ciolates policy then I, and anyone else for that matter, reverts it, or modifies it appropiately. I don't enforce my agenda, nor does anyone else. Lancer1289 00:53, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * By "obsolete" I meant the codex page of ME1 site applies only to the year 2183, that was all. Eddo36 01:18, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok then, because that was very confusing. However again we don't know if the code has been change, or hasn't for that matter. A note would be speculation either way, and in this case, it would be against policy. I really don't see what the problem is with the way it is currently and jsut saying something like "however we don't know if that is still her vocational code in ME2," would be speculation because we don't know. Until we have more info, and based on past instances with unknown items, we leave it until we have something new that affect it. If BioWare put up something about Ash and her vocation code changing, I'd be the first to change it, however we don't so again usually we just leave it until we know something different. Lancer1289 01:28, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well this subject goes beyond Ashley's MVC, but other things in ME universe. There should be a specified timeline for the contents here, just a suggestion. Eddo36 01:34, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * What exactly do you mean, becuase we do have a timeline here: Timeline. Granted it's a general overview, and doesn't get into specifics, that is for articles. However, is that what you were refering to, or am I misunderstanding you again? Lancer1289 01:41, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't mean a Timeline of Events page that you already have. I mean just listing what year this specific piece of information (in this case that Ashley is B4) applies to. She wasn't B4 in 2150 when she wasn't even born, and the ME universe encompasses more than one year. Eddo36 01:50, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * What exactly do you mean, becuase we do have a timeline here: Timeline. Granted it's a general overview, and doesn't get into specifics, that is for articles. However, is that what you were refering to, or am I misunderstanding you again? Lancer1289 01:41, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't mean a Timeline of Events page that you already have. I mean just listing what year this specific piece of information (in this case that Ashley is B4) applies to. She wasn't B4 in 2150 when she wasn't even born, and the ME universe encompasses more than one year. Eddo36 01:50, May 30, 2010 (UTC)

Ok, so here's what I'm thinking: This is what we know of the Alliance Vocational Code system- "A soldier's MVC indicates proficiency, not rank. The letter notes career path; the number indicates level of experience, as indicated by service record, technical scores, and commendations." Now, we have no indication that anything other than her rank has changed. Nothing is mentioned about enhancements to her service record, technical scores, or her commendations. As such, any assumption that those have changed is speculation. Therefor, any edits made to the article based on those assumptions would also be speculation. Just trying to put this in policy perspective here. SpartHawg948 01:54, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) Ok I'm still not sure what you are asking however I'll take a stab at it. Do you mean a timeline of when information is considered relevant? If that is what you mean then that article would probably overload the sever that this wiki is on because it would have to cover every piece of information we have. An article like that wouldn't be good because then every new piece of information would have to be evaluated for how long it lasts. I think, and don't quote me here, the policy currenly is that info is considered fact until we have something that contraditcts it, updates it, or removes it all together. Again don't quote me on that, but that is the general polciy that seems to be around here. Spart need a comment on this one.Lancer1289 02:02, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't mean create a whole new enormous article. I just suggest add the year-note INSIDE the current articles with information that pertains to a short time period. For example, just put in parenthesis (as of 2183) or something next to where it says "Ashley is B4" on Trivia section. Eddo36 02:08, May 30, 2010 (UTC)

But how do we know this only pertains to a short time period? At that point and rank in a military career, a vocational code change doesn't happen that often, at least not in the contemporary US Military, much of which the Alliance military is based off of. SpartHawg948 02:10, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * I agree, we don't know how long it lasts, and I managed to get in contact with one of my cousins in the navy, currently on liberty. He is going on 6 yeas now, and he was a petty officer third class, now a petty officer first class, and his vocational code has never changed. Lancer1289 02:14, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well by "short time period" I don't mean few years etc. I mean that it isn't forever. Ashley wasn't B4 in 2150 when she wasn't born, and ME universe does span through that year and more. Eddo36 02:16, May 30, 2010 (UTC)

Well of course she wasn't a B4 when she was born, but the info is pretty specific as to when it takes place (i.e. well after she was born) and there is 0 indication that it has changed in the two years since. We're talking the pertinent years here, not years that take place before 2183. SpartHawg948 02:19, May 30, 2010 (UTC)

As long as the info is pretty specific of when it takes place, that's all I was saying. So if they make a ME prequel during First Contact War or Rachni War or something, the info would be less confusing due to not being updated since Ashley isn't B4 during that time. Eddo36 02:21, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict)Additionally, you have to consider that the article states that "According to Bioware's official data, Ashley's Military Vocational Code is B4". Inserting a bit that states that this is the case in ME implies (if not stating out-and-out) that BioWare's official data states that she was only a b4 in ME. Given that the only official BioWare data we have on the matter states she is a B4, and there has been nothing from BioWare to suggest that this data is not still accurate, I don't see why this is even an issue. Additionally, I should hope that her vocational code at the time of the First Contact War and the Rachni War wouldn't be an issue. After all, as you yourself pointed out, she wasn't a B4 before she was born! :P SpartHawg948 02:25, May 30, 2010 (UTC)

The source of the e-mail №1
What is the source of that e-mail (to Sarah Williams ) quoted at length in the main article? I do not recall seeing it in the game.--92.225.60.85 14:35, February 5, 2011 (UTC)
 * The Source is Ashely's article on the BioWare's Mass Effect Site. See here: Ashely's article at the BioWare site. Lancer1289 17:49, February 5, 2011 (UTC)

Seeker Swarm Sting
How did Ashley managed to nullify the effects of the seeker swarm sting, while up to that point only Shepard knew about the Collectors and their Seekers to begin with? Is this a pointer to Alliance involvment, is Ashley a traitor, or isn t that even Ashley at all? This really bothers me because it would be a great inconsistency in the plot and the writing of the story. She is stung, paralyzed, but yet shows up at the end as if nothing would have happened, she doesn t even mention it. Any input on this?
 * Maybe when the Collectors left, the effects nullified. On the other hand, another theory is that it wears off after a time. I highly, highly doubt Ashley is a traitor or that the person we see isn't Ashley. I really can't see how it is an inconsistency when there are a number of things that could logically explain it. After all we see Ashley getting stung and then the colonists recovered afterward so there are again many possible reasonable explanations apart from "a great inconsistency" two of them I presented above. In addition, doesn't medication wear off after a period of time? Lancer1289 17:30, February 28, 2011 (UTC)


 * Exactly what I was going to say. Could be that the paralysis wears off rapidly and requires the seeker swarms to re-sting people constantly until the Collectors can store them in pods; when the Collectors have to leave and the swarms are taken away, everyone recovers in a matter of minutes. Whatever the actual explanation, I'm sure it's nothing so out there as "Ashley is a Collector" or "the Alliance is in on it". -- Commdor (Talk) 17:44, February 28, 2011 (UTC)

Spectre
Where was it confirmed that ashley becomes a spectre in ME3?


 * PSN magazine. It's one of the top blogs on the wiki right now. Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem 03:12, April 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * A link to the blog probably would have helped so the user could read further. Lancer1289 03:15, April 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't happen to keep track of blogs I've viewed several hours prior, as I've other things on my mind in the meantime. Otherwise it would've been done, or rather I'd just've sent the commenter to JakePT's page. Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem 03:17, April 24, 2011 (UTC)
 * It's just a helpfulness thing. Since the user did question where we got the information, it would have been a good idea to provide the user with a link to the blog so the user could read where it is from, and possibly learn more information that they haven't yet. Some people don't know the ins and outs of a wiki so they many not know where that specific blog is, so giving them a nudge in the right direction is helpful. Lancer1289 03:22, April 24, 2011 (UTC)

ME3 Ash screen?
Anyone cares to insert GI's pic of Ash from ME3 to this page? http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110411043426/masseffect/images/9/94/Ashley_Williams_in_Mass_Effect_3.jpg 62.68.172.41 21:22, April 27, 2011 (UTC)

No, the pic is to low quality.--Legionwrex 21:26, April 27, 2011 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) Yes I mind as it's super low quality. I will say it again, just because we have an image, doesn’t mean we have to use it. Especially one that is grainy and low quality. We can wait for higher quality shots. Lancer1289 21:28, April 27, 2011 (UTC)

Beat you to it by two seconds lancer.--207.200.116.73 21:32, April 27, 2011 (UTC)

Ashley Picture
I Found a sligtly better version of ashleys ME3 picture not sure weather its good enough too insert into the article ?--DC 00:18, June 9, 2011 (UTC)




 * I think we'll be holding off on adding any ME3 images of Ashley in the article until we can expand the ME3 section, but I'd say this is better than anything else we've had, looks a screenshot. I went ahead and cropped it for use in the Characters article. -- Commdor (Talk) 00:48, June 9, 2011 (UTC)

Ok no problem that makes sense, (She Look Much Better With Long Hair Didnt Expect That) thanks for responding Commdor--DC 01:20, June 9, 2011 (UTC)

Has Bioware even confirmed this is Ashley and not a Female Shepard? The July 2011 US/Canada PC Gamer implied that it was a female shepard when it made a crack at the "bust slider" in charachter creation or something--24.224.193.106 02:26, June 9, 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes that is Ashley. Lancer1289 02:28, June 9, 2011 (UTC)

Rank of Lieutenant
Ash seems to have been promoted to Lieutenant as Anderson is referring to her by her rank over the radio when trying to call the Normandy to pick them up from the damaged harbour. This was in the the demo.
 * My perspective here is: sure it was in the demo. So? Lots of things are in demos. Including things that end up not being canon. All sorts of things were in the demos for the first game that weren't actually in the finished product. Remember all those miners on Caleston we were going to save in ME? I do. Too bad it never made it into the game. Silly demos... SpartHawg948 09:40, June 9, 2011 (UTC)

Well silly me. I guess they'll just have to make Keith David rerecord all his lines where he refers to Ashley by Lieutenant. Silly me.
 * We'll just have to wait until ME3 is released, or until a dev says something for this to be confirmed. Lancer1289 14:35, June 9, 2011 (UTC)

Absolutely. I was simply pointing out that it appears she's a lieutenant - not that there was mountains of irrefutable proof that she is a lieutenant :P. Cheers Lancer.
 * And I was doing the same: pointing out that it appears that she's a lieutenant, and that there is not a mountain of irrefutable proof that she is a lieutenant. So we seem to be in complete agreement. SpartHawg948 23:20, June 9, 2011 (UTC)
 * And as for re-recording lines, well... not necessarily. They could just not use the dialogue you're referring to. They did have to do that with the example I cite too, didn't they? All of the dialogue from Ashley, Garrus, and Shepard which was used in the demo didn't make it into the game, after all. :P SpartHawg948 23:22, June 9, 2011 (UTC)

Spectre?
This feels like speculation to me. I just read the magazine scans and couldn't find any confirmation that the info was confirmed by a developer. That entire section is full of speculation and little jokes. Unless you take it as fact that you will be able to "sex 'Liara' up till she's blue(r) in the face".


 * The GameInformer article on ME3 clearly states Ashley/Kaidan will be spectres in the game. Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem 11:36, July 2, 2011 (UTC)
 * I have the article in front of me right now and it says nothing about either Ashley or Kaidan being a spectre.


 * Check the June 2011 issue of Playstation 3 Magazine (UK Edition, Issue 140) if you have it. -- Commdor (Talk) 22:05, July 2, 2011 (UTC)


 * I've found a download of scans of the magazine here. On page 8 of the .pdf, the infobox for Kaidan Alenko states "Like Ashley, Kaidan dates from the first Mass Effect, and will appear if you saved him at the end instead of her. Both characters have been remodelled, and both have been promoted to Spectre." -- Commdor (Talk) 22:46, July 2, 2011 (UTC)

As well as in all the trailers they are wearing armor similar to Tela Vasir's that have the Specter symbol on them.--Xaero Dumort 04:56, July 3, 2011 (UTC)

I read the PSM3 article which is exactly why I think this is speculation. James Sanders is also identified as the sniper from the first trailer in this article, but that's not true. This article is the only source I can find for this little tidbit and it has no confirmation or secondary sources. I haven't seen the Spectre symbol anywhere on the new design for Ashley or Kaidan, but even if it's there, without developer confirmation it doesn't belong in the wiki.


 * But that's only one error, and it's not the only source I've seen make that mistake. I don't think it makes sense to doubt the rest of this source because of one error, especially when many other things in it are backed up by multiple sources. -- Commdor (Talk) 06:01, July 3, 2011 (UTC)
 * What other source backs this claim up? Did any other interviewer manage to get this quote?  Which developer confirmed this?  Is there a line in the demo where Ashley/Kaidan is referred to as a Spectre?  Is there anything other than this throwaway pic-caption that can even remotely suggest that Ashley/Kaidan is a spectre?  I've admired the dedication of this wiki to only allowing proven facts.  I think everyone here can agree that the enforcement of the rule of confirmation has been strident.  By that standard, removing this uncorraborated statement should be a no-brainer.


 * That would most likely be found in the BioWare forums, as BioWare devs regularly contribute on there. Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem 12:32, July 3, 2011 (UTC)
 * I still don't see any reason to doubt this one part of the source if so much of the rest of it is spot-on. The Spectre info conflicts with nothing we already know, and it seems like a rather out-of-the-blue detail for a game news outlet to just make up. I recall that in the time before ME2 released, one game site reported that the geth from the first ME2 trailer would be a squadmate, but many did not believe it because the article had a few errors. Yet when ME2 was released, did we not get Legion? I've looked around for a developer's word on the Spectre issue, but have been unsuccessful. I did, however, find this, which supports Xaero Dumort's assertion that the Spectre symbol is on Kaidan's armor. It may not be developer confirmation, but it certainly backs up the magazine's statement. I'm more convinced now that this info is valid, and will oppose its removal unless a developer outright says it is wrong (preferably), or Spart or the community overrule me. -- Commdor (Talk) 19:18, July 3, 2011 (UTC)

In the trailer that showed Normandy rescuing Commander Shepard from Earth showed Ashley had a Spectre symbol on her chest at 5:19 .71.184.217.18