User talk:Ralok

Hi, welcome to Mass Effect Wiki! Thanks for your edit to the User talk:Tullis page.

Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! -- Tullis (Talk) 04:57, May 24, 2009

Re: Need Help With Something
i am doing a comprehensive paperr on wiki vandelism for my web design class. And with science fiction wiki's people tend to add there own non canonical races, i noticed there was a races added by a vandal, this race is called the garol (i think). is there any chance i can get some information on specific aspects of this fictitious race.
 * Yes, you have that name correct. However, as a side note, I personally wouldn't class the editor who created this content as a vandal in the traditional sense. I don't believe there was any malice, just over-enthusiasm and a desire to be involved. It only crossed the line into vandalism once it became a nuisance.
 * If you're still interested, the pages in question have been deleted, but I can give you the links to view the deleted content:
 * View page history for the original 'garol' page here
 * View page history for 'Dagnus', given as the garol homeworld, here
 * More discussion of the 'garol' can be found here
 * Edit to the quarian page with a paragraph on the 'garol' can be seen here
 * You might also be interested in the discussion that remains on Talk:Races
 * If this is useful for your paper, this 'garol' episode also directly influenced our policy on speculation
 * If these links don't work or you have problems viewing them, give me another poke and I'll see what I can do for you. --Tullis 05:18, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

thank you tullis, but i am unable to access some of those pages because i do not belong to any of the proper groups, however i did manages to get some information on them from the quarian page. thank you for your time ralok 05:26, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Hmph. Those "view deleted content" links must be sysop only. Sorry.
 * I'm glad you managed to get some useful data regardless. Please let us know if we can help you any further. --Tullis 05:32, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

thank you but i got all the information that i needed for the comparison to other non true races from other sci-fi wiki's your help is appreciated ma'am ralok 05:45, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Gillian Grayson Talk page
I found your edit to Talk:Gillian Grayson to be utterly appalling, and offensive to other users. Kindly remove these comments immediately or face a ban. --Tullis 01:17, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

i will remove the comment but i have a right to my opinion. also i had a right to state facts. there is no viral, bacterial, genetic, or any brain functions that have been connected to this so called mental condition. however the diagnosis of borderline autistic is authentic, as i was diagnosed three years ago, they did this without any type of physical test. i was diagnosed with a disorder that has no proof of exsistence. so i have a personal prejudice to any discussion about the disorder. please do not hate me because of my fact based opinion. ralok 03:46, 25 May 2009 (UTC)


 * True, you are entitled to have an opinion. However, that entitlement does not extend to you being free to express it in such an offensive manner. The members of this community have rights too, and when you address other users in that fashion, and place your opinion in inflammatory language on a science fiction wiki rather than an autism forum, *I* have a right to take exception to such behaviour. However, I do not "hate you" and we can, hopefully, consider this closed and move on. --Tullis 04:21, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

great now i am pointlessly angry, i am going to go yell at my dog now for no appearent reason ralok 05:02, 25 May 2009 (UTC)

Jath'Amon
Just wanted to point out that it appears you missed some content on the Talk:Jath'Amon page. I never doubted he was a batarian based on his height or weight, nor did I ever make statements to that effect. First off, any statement to that effect would be ridiculous, and secondly, there was never any way for me to gauge his height or weight. There were two reasons I doubted he was a batarian, both of which I stated clearly: 1)The batarians do not have diplomatic relations with the Citadel, thus I questioned whether he was the batarian ambassador or an ambassador from another race that did maintain relations w/ both the batarians and the Citadel, and 2)The original picture in the article DID NOT show Jath'Amon's second pair of eyes, as they were concealed behind his eyebrows. In fact, the reason the current picture, with the two pairs of eyes plainly visible, was added was due to my query. If you go back and re-read it you will see that I was presented with evidence and conceded that Jath'Amon is a batarian six months before you made your comment. SpartHawg948 10:57, November 2, 2009 (UTC)

Behaviour towards other editors
Just wanted to point out, in light of your recent statements, that as per the Community Guidelines, specifically the sections on language, talk pages and banning, crude or offensive language and insulting other users are grounds for being banned from the site. I am, of course referring to lovely tidbits such as "you are an idiot, thats not debatable you simply are". Lovely. Please bear in mind as well that statements such as "dont worry about my aggression I am just horribly sick today and i aint in the mood to deal with people, i dont want to discuss the nature of my illness, but something came out of my body looking like collector-tech", made after insulting someone else, do not excuse it in the least. If the language isn't something the insulted person should worry about, or is something you only said b/c you weren't feeling well, then why did you even include it in the first place? Illness is not an excuse for poor manners. If health issues were an acceptable excuse for poor manners, I would be the loudest, most insulting person on this site, flinging insults and obscenities in all directions. However, this is not the case, so a modicum of civility would be appreciated in the future, lest repeat incidents make banning necessary. SpartHawg948 01:28, November 14, 2009 (UTC)


 * sorry ralok 18:01, November 14, 2009 (UTC)

Lets Talk about My Behavior
ok here it is if you have a complaint put it here, or if you need to start a discuiion about why I act hostile please do. ralok 08:41, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * First off, when I comment on spelling it's b/c I'm trying to be helpful. I love the English language. It's great. And, as an admin at a wiki (where checking spelling and grammar is an important part of the gig), this stuff leaps out at me and bugs the crap out of me. As for the admins supposedly trying to make you look bad, to be brutally honest, I don't need to worry about it, you seem to manage just fine. Lets see... making some pretty reprehensible statements about autism and people with autism, calling people idiots because they don't agree with one of your theories, calling people cockbites, mocking other users for questions that were asked and resolved half a year earlier, and as another admin stated succinctly, combative and rude edits. That makes a pretty compelling case, I think. If you wish to contest any of this, be my guest, but again, please keep it civil. SpartHawg948 08:50, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * hmmmmmmmmmmmm, i didnt realise that was resolved, there was a big line beetween the starting thing and a resolution something i wasnt even aware was allowed (this is the way i remember it) and when you correct a persons english after they have admitted to being a poor typist only makes you sound like a terrible person. I should have that as my home page very large letters declaring myself a poo typist. ralok 09:07, November 19, 2009 (UTC)

"Sooo... this is guy is batarian? Could have fooled me! SpartHawg948 04:21, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

He is in fact a Batarian, the picture doesn't really do him justice. He has four eyes, the weird moustache skin flaps, the nose... he looks like a Batarian shaped like a Volus.SpectreJustice 05:18, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Gotcha. Ok, two things. 1) If it's really the picture that doesn't do him justice, could someone supply a picture (or screenshot) that does? And 2) Please remember, in Mass Effect, alien race names are not capitalized! Thanks. SpartHawg948 05:04, 24 June 2009 (UTC)"

Yes- based off those statements, it WAS resolved. Although of all the things listed above, that was the one that concerned me least. It was mostly the rude and insulting comments towards other users. If you refrain from those in the future, you'll have no problems with me. And again, the english thing is part of the admin gig. Poor spelling in one place (talk page edits) tends to bleed into other locations (article edits) so I try to nip it in the bud wherever possible. Even a cursory examination of my contributions to other users will show that you are by no means the only person I have talked to about spelling, so please do not try to make this into me vs you here, it isn't. Also, calling someone a terrible person goes back to the whole no insults thing, so please refrain from that in the future. SpartHawg948 09:20, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * i didnt call you a terrible person, i just pointed out that your actions make you sound like a terrible person, and appearently i remembered the situation differently. I think your an ok guy, probably better than me usually I feel I only get hostile if someone says that my opinion or speculation is completly invalid because of there opinion or speculation. Or interpretation of a sentence from a psychic alien bug that cannot speak proper english, i get a little defensive about my opinions, and i get really offensive if people act like im stupid. Like repeatedly pointing out in a discussion about how the collectors and reapers might be linked that there is a collector and reaper link. Or not knowing what the word psychic means and then proceed to tell me abilities arent psychic because its known exactly how those abilities work. ralok 09:29, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * That is understandable but you have to bear in mind that if you post an opinion, theory, or speculation on a public talk page, other people WILL comment on it, and many comments will be critical. That's just the nature of the beast. And some comments may appear to make you appear somewhat less well informed. It happens. It's happened to me, as well as plenty of other people around here. I don't recall anyone ever saying one of your opinions was completely invalid SOLELY because it was your opinion/speculation. If you have specific examples I'd be happy to look into it, but every time I've seen someone critique one of your ideas it has been for valid reasons. And, in an aside, when you get into an argument with someone about whether or not the Collectors use psychic powers as opposed to something else, then attempt to show examples, you have to expect that if someone else has evidence that those examples are NOT psychic powers they will also share it. If you wish to continue contributing all I ask is you keep the hostility in check. If you cannot do this, or cannot control your anger when someone comments on one of your theories or something like that, maybe a wiki isn't for you, as this is a public setting. SpartHawg948 09:39, November 19, 2009 (UTC)

ok the reason for my confusion is because i replied to something beneath the conversation at the top of the page, i didnt read that conversation. I just read the status tab not hte previous conversation. you should have put in bolded words underneath what you wrote "situation resolved see previous conversation" and then you come running along telling me basically that i am a bad person because i wanted to contribute (perhaps a little more rude than a should have) to a discussion. As a side note i am giving up on trying comedy on the internet i always sounds like an a** when i attempt it (that would be myself that i reffered to as an a**) ralok 09:41, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * I didn't feel the need to place anything in bold text. All that was needed was to read the section above to get the context. I always read the other comments to make sure I understand the context, I didn't know I was obligated to inform you to do the same. That also doesn't explain the comments that you claim I said that I never did. You claimed that I questioned whether he was batarian b/c "he is overweight and shorter than most batarians" (those are your exact words). I never said anything of the sort. That's what really compelled me to respond. I do not like people putting words in my mouth, which you did. I never said you were a bad person for contributing, just that maybe you should read the entirety of the page you are contributing to beforehand. That isn't an unreasonable request. SpartHawg948 09:50, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * you said he didnt look like a batarian AT ALL, he has pretty much all of the traits of a batarian except for being overwight and short, so i assumed it was those traits that caused the confusion. plus for a person who cares proper spelling it seems odd that you wouldnt care about keeping a conversation as linear as possible. Those were two seperate sections, i didnt read the first section when i made my comment i had no reason to i didnt know it was relevent. you could have just said to me that it had been resolved then pointed out the previous conversation. Instead you typed two paragraphs in two different places wasting time for both of us. ralok 10:00, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * Ok, well this is rapidly spiraling towards irrelevancy. You started a section concerning your behavior, asked the admins to make applicable posts there, then when I did so and tried to offer advice, latched onto the most frivolous offense (as opposed to the parts where you called people cockbites and idiots, as well as the autism bit) and kept at it even after I tried to offer some helpful advice and leave it at that. So I'm not gonna humor this anymore. Please refer back to my third post, and please also keep something in mind: I cannot speak for Tullis, but I have shown an uncharacteristic amount of patience and forgiveness. I'm about out of both, so please, again, heed the advice in my third post. I'm about out of warnings, which only leaves banning in my bag of admin tricks, and I don't want it to come to that. As we say in the Air Force, PLEASE take this final opportunity to "straighten up and fly right". SpartHawg948 10:09, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * BAH THIS IS GOING NOWHERE, I AM SOMEWHERE BETWEEN ANGRY AND HUNGRY AND YOU ARE SOMEWHERE BETWEEN UPSET AND DISSAPOINTED, and in my experience disputes can go on forever when people are like this. Can we end this. And btw while we are talking do you happen to have a link for the original batarian portait or a source for urdnot wrexs age.

Requested sources

 * - Note that the second pair of eyes is not visible. This, combined with the shape of the head and the "ear" looking things, absent from all previously seen batarians, are what made me question his race, NOT height or weight.


 * Also, no, I have no source for the Wrex age thing. That is why I have not commented on it thus far. SpartHawg948 10:19, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * ok thats the first image i need, ummm do you happen to have a source for the oiriginal image of the batarian in the codex in the primary mass effect game. Before bring own the sky is downloaded it has a different image. i have been trying to find it for like three hours and i dont know if deleteing bring own the sky will ruin my save files or not. do you know anyway to get it. ralok 10:23, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * It would appear the image has been deleted from the wiki. SpartHawg948 10:26, November 19, 2009 (UTC)


 * dont waste your time trying to find it, i am sure you have more impotant things to. And i am POSITIVE that i have more important things to do. Thank you for thee image of that guy it will go a long way in the compare and contrast that I write (Onot necceesarily fo the wiki but for something) ralok 10:28, November 19, 2009 (UTC)

Quarian Info
The information about the quarians strip-mining when they arrive in a system is taken directly from in-game sources (please see the entry on the quarian economy. All JakePT was doing when he mentioned he found the information here was pointing out that the information was readily available, from a legitimate source, right here on the site with about 2 seconds of research time. Removal of valid content is of course considered vandalism, and the Codex is a valid source. SpartHawg948 04:20, December 28, 2009 (UTC)


 * Ok I was using the primary quarian entry in thecodex as my source of information actually, and somehow i dont have the economy entry with my currenty sheard, had to go back to my last one to confirm just now, misunderstanding. I'll try and avoid that.Also any information on how to acquire the economy entry would be helpful. ralok 04:36, December 28, 2009 (UTC)

A pretty cool glitch...
I loaded up a saved game on my 360 a few minutes ago and experienced a glitch I'd never seen before: my Shepard is wearing his BDUs (no armor) and is missing his assault rifle, and all my weapons except the pistol disappear when I switch away from them, and the assault rifle fails to show in the radial menu. I had Wrex and Garrus as my away team; they still had their armor, unlike me, but like me, their assault rifles were missing. The specific location is right outside Lorik Quinn's office, prior to the encounter with ERCS Sergeant Kaira Sterling in Port Hanshan. Loadout was unmodified Specter X gear across the board, with unmodified Predator H X, Mercenary X Medium, and Agent X Light for myself, Wrex, and Garrus, respectively. During the encounter and all subsequent cinematics, Shepard remained unarmored, including when I had him mount and dismount the Mako where your party usually activates the environmental seals on their helmets. It was pretty cool walking around looking like a C-Sec officer for a while, but when I went to the inventory screen to try to select my armor or assault rifle, the game became unresponsive. Not to say it locked up, but it seemed like there was a null value for the rifle, and it wouldn't let me navigate away until the non-existant thing loaded. Subsequent saves and reloads contiguous to the original file propagate the glitch, with the sole change of my other weapons staying on my back with subsequent reloads (excepting the assault rifle). I looked on the wiki and couldn't find a glitch like this, and figured I'd toss it to a featured user to see if you guys had ever encountered it. Thanks in advance. MarinesNeverDie 06:14, December 30, 2009 (UTC)


 * Cant say that ever happened to me, if it did i would have gotten it on video. (feature user wtf???) ralok 07:31, December 30, 2009 (UTC)

good catch!
I totally undid the wrong edit on the Miranda Lawson page... instead of removing the speculation, I added that other editor's rant back into the article. Oop... anywho, nice catch, and good looking out! SpartHawg948 00:53, December 31, 2009 (UTC)


 * Oh thank god I almost lost faith in you for a second. I kinda freaked ou, i was all wtf did you do that for. ralok 00:57, December 31, 2009 (UTC)


 * All it would have taken was for you to actually LOOK at the history and READ my edit summary. I do not enjoy being lectured by someone who, quite frankly has no leg to stand on in this discussion. I do not wish to start a lengthy argument with this, I'm just a bit irate (rather understandably, I believe) by your attempt at lecturing me. Please in the future get the facts straight first. Thanks, SpartHawg948 01:01, December 31, 2009 (UTC)


 * Sorry i had no idea what had happened man, I was actually kinda scared there fora second that your account might have been hacked. I didnt know what to do so i just sorta panicked and wrote a long almost nonsense speach. ralok 01:12, December 31, 2009 (UTC)


 * No worries. I kind of overreacted too. This whole situation on the Miranda Lawson page (and the similar one w/ the Grunt page) and a few other things have been making this a less than pleasant day... still, I was a little more abrasive than usual, for which I apologize. SpartHawg948 01:49, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

Ban
Regarding this recent edit summary to the genophage article:


 * Theoretically saren is the lovecihld of juhani and zaalbar from kotor and they arrived in the mass effect universe through a temporal gateway. But i am not going to write that am I.

Both SpartHawg and I have repeatedly warned you about your attitude toward other users, and your use of combative language. I have also cautioned you, repeatedly, that this could result in a ban. Therefore I hope you will understand that I feel I have no choice now but to take action: you're now banned for three weeks. Please take this time to reconsider your attitude to other users. --Tullis 20:55, January 3, 2010 (UTC)


 * really? after all the extreme improvements i have made in my behavior,an all the help i have provided with keeping vandalism like that out of the wiki, helping keep speculation to a minimum. That is kind of cold, I was only pointing out why we dont put theories on the wiki. Because once you put one theory pretty soon it becomes complete fanon, i think you are turning a hammer into a bomb. But i will respect your decision to ban me, only because the ban will expre before mass effect 2 is released. Anything after that would be just cruel to a person who edits on this wiki as much as i do. ralok 21:16, January 3, 2010 (UTC)

Question Mark?
how is it that i am still capable of writing in my talk page despite a small ban, anyways i am pretty sure this will show up on the recent edit page anyways. SpartHawg, i noticed on your talk page that there is a guy that basically posted (in not exact) "hey your a jerk, because you did your job. And if you respond to me you will be a bigger jerk. ARGH" just remember one of hte golden rules of the internet friend, do not uner any circumstances feed the troll. ralok 14:51, January 4, 2010 (UTC)

Can I come back now
I want back in, or at least to be able to blog still. I have adequeitly learned my lesson. SpartHawg can tell you folks that I tend to learn from my mistakes (although it isnt easy), normally I would take my punishment but the official mass effect forums are a mess, its filled with insane trolls. This website is a stable well adjusted community, it deals in facts, i just came from a thread b***ing about how mass effect 2 is to much like the fantastic 4. Heck compared to the mass effect 2 official forum I am a well adjusted inividual, its that bad. And its the only other community I know of. So if it isnt to much trouble i would like to come back to this community, i can promise i will be good. Dont bother replying if the answer is no. I will take my punishment. ralok 16:39, January 4, 2010 (UTC)
 * Please don't presume to speak for me, as you did above. I would say nothing of the sort if asked. I haven't seen any indication of learning from mistakes. So again, please don't do me the disservice of telling people what I can and can't tell them. I'm quite capable of forming and expressing my own opinions. Thanks, SpartHawg948 05:45, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * Addendum- Please know that, having learned that you purposely and willfully lied about me insulting you just to gain some sort of upper hand in an online debate about a video game, I cannot in good conscience support your ban being lifted earlier than the current expiration date. Having lost the ability to trust anything you say, since you seem willing to use lies for frivolous, infinitesimal gains, I now consider this matter and this correspondence at an end. Good day. SpartHawg948 06:06, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Enough.
Ralok, you have been banned less than two days, and you have already used the privilege I left you (of editing your talk page) to continue your tirade against SH. Saying you "want back in" is not good enough. I will not tolerate rude and combative behaviour on this wiki, and whatever your opinion as to the other user involved, the fact is that you are continuing this situation by responding to it. It takes two people to continue an argument, and this ban has apparently made little impression on you. You have also insulted other users before, and been warned, and still continued to act this way. I even removed the Biology section of "Collectors", and yet this argument is STILL going on!

I discussed the situation with the other party and tried to reach an accord after your emails, and informed you I was doing so, then I see you using your talk page in this manner. "Promising to be good" means nothing to me when I see you are apparently determined to continue the behaviour you were banned for in the first place. Also, "respecting my ban" because it will expire before ME2 comes out is actually the opposite of respecting someone trying to keep order.

You say this is "a stable well adjusted community": you are working against that ideal. You also say, yourself you are a person who needs time to calm down; I am therefore removing your talk page privileges for the remainder of your ban. If you do not take the time to calm down and come back as a responsible editor, you will be permanently banned. I have done my best to be fair; I have tried to give you all possible benefit of the doubt, but I am now officially out of patience. --Tullis 23:22, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Wrong SpartHawg
I know i have a temporary ban, and it is my hope that you find this through the activity feed. As this is hte only page I am allowed to leave messages on, but i felt i needed to take a stand and put a fact forward about the collector biology section. There is no evidence that they collectors use genetic manipulation on themselves, its just as likely that they are shapeshifters(speculation). And most importantly nobody ever says the collectors actually stun anybody. Watch the video and listen, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vL5u2xi6mNQ 1:05. . . ."very quickyl swarms of little bugs swarm and they paralyze everbody in the colony, at that point its very easy for the collectors to gather up the people", he never says, "little collectors swarm out and paralyze" in fact his statement seems to indicate a distinction beetween the collectors and the little bugs. I hope that adds to the discussion :) please do not misinterpret anything I have said as an insult, that would hurt my feelings. ralok 02:48, January 5, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, if you don't want it taken as an insult, maybe call this section something other than "Wrong SpartHawg". Calling someone wrong tends to be something that may make the other person feel just a little insulted, especially when they aren't wrong. There is no direct evidence that the Collectors engage in genetic manipulation, but there is a fair bit of circumstantial evidence. You saying "There is no evidence that they collectors use genetic manipulation on themselves, its just as likely that they are shapeshifters(speculation)." is not really a viable argument to the contrary, as you just state I am wrong without offering any counters to the points I made. Ditto for the little bugs. There is still a bit of circumstantial evidence that they could be a type of Collector, and none that they are trained animals, as was suggested. Also, he said "sweep" not "swarm" out. And no, no suggestion of distinction was made. Little bugs sweep out followed by... bigger bugs. No distinction was made. My main point that all the info present is in 100% compliance with the speculation policy is still valid. And just to reiterate, don't make an entire section proclaiming I am wrong, offer no evidence to support your claim, and expect me to not take it as at least somewhat insulting, if not to me per se than at least an insult to my intelligence. SpartHawg948 04:42, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * A distinction was made, the small bugs were never refferd to as collectors. He says a collector ship lands, then small bugs paralyze everybody, then he says at that point its easy for the collectors to gather up the people. I argue that if they are collectors he would have said that the land the ship, then they swarm out, then gather without stopping refer to the bugs as something other than collects.. He never says the collectors paralyze people. I think the mention of genetic manipulation should be changed, there is no proof of this, just plain ansimple, there are other viable explanations, like they could be similiar to the brood (marvel) or the xenomorph (avp), I could argue that them gathering humans is evidence for this. But i dont, i just suggest that any form of speculation as to why they are humanoid be removed. ralok 04:49, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * Not really a distinction. They also don't refer to the leader as a Collector, they just say the Collectors are controlled by a leader. Does that make the leader any less of a Collector? Nope. You can't pick apart every bit of semantics and expect that any time anyone from BioWare says anything about the game, it's going to be 100% scripted and off a teleprompter. Your idea of what he would have said if the little bugs were Collectors is not fact. Not by a long shot. And again, as I explained at length and you have not refuted other than to say it is wrong, there is circumstantial evidence for the genetic manipulation bit, which is, for the third time now, in 100% compliance with speculation policy. Speculation that is up to par is allowed, it's just that we have some rather stringent requirements it must meet. And again, I would caution you to watch how you address other users. Again, entitling a section "Wrong SpartHawg" (aside from the fact that no evidence that I am wrong has been presented) is hardly the language someone asking to have a ban for inappropriate comments/behavior towards other users should be displaying. You state above that I can tell Tullis that you have learned from past mistakes. I've gotta say, I'm not seeing it. SpartHawg948 05:04, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Spart you are turning a hammeer into a nuclear bomb, all i did was say that you are wrong. Which you sort of are, i wrote an article about the zeioph that had less speculation in it than the collectors article and i got insulted by you for it. I think you are being unfair. All i am proposing is that the reference to the small bugs being collectors be removed and that any talk on why they apepar humonoid be removed, thats fair. There is no evidence to suggest they even do genetic experimentation, or experimentation of any type on the people that they collect. Provide this evidence and i will kowtow, but i dont see any. ralok 05:14, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * You mean the items that are properly labeled as speculation (which they are, if you actually read it, not once are they passed off as fact), have at least some supporting evidence (which again, you appear to have made no attempt to refute other than calling it wrong) and are properly sourced? Wait a minute, aren't those the three criteria for allowing speculation? They sure are! Whereas the speculation in your zeioph article did not meet those same criteria. So again, no, I am not wrong in stating that the items are good to stay in the article. As for unfair, how about calling someone wrong, not providing proof, and then tap-dancing around the issue when the person you called wrong cries foul? Hardly seems fair. And please, show me where I "insulted" you about your zeioph article. Please. SpartHawg948 05:25, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * Nothing is sourced, nothing is labeled as speculation. And you just assume that there is genetic experiments going on. Tell me what the sources are for any of this information. I dont see any soruces anywhere. Did you even look at the collectors page, there isnt a speculation disclaimer above the biology section or anything its all just passed off as fact, or the wordd apppear is used to make the article sound uncertain. ralok 05:33, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * As I stated quite clearly on the thread at Talk:Collectors, the source is the Enemies of Mass Effect video, along with a little bit from Mass Effect:Ascension. It's noted as speculation through repeated use of the words/phrases "appear to", "appears to", "suggests", "likely due to", etc. As I stated above, nothing speculative is stated as fact. Makes me wonder if you even looked at the Collectors page, or my entry on the talk page. Also, thanks for the quote demonstrating where I supposedly insulted you about your proposed zeioph page. Nothing I like more than being falsely accused. SpartHawg948 05:39, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * I lied when i said that you insulted me, i was just rolling with bad feelings and i allowed them to manifest themselves into words. And sources being on the talk page according to what i have read on the speculation policy is not allowed, there has to be a little link next to it that takes you to the proof. Or am i misreading it http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Speculation#Speculation     and there isstill no proof that they genetically modify themselves, or that they perform any form of experimentation genetic or otherwise. That specific speculation on why they are bipedal is based on more speculation. It should just say that its odd that they are bipedal when the rest of their species appears to be multipeds, or say the reason is unknown. ralok 05:46, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * Wow. Words cannot explain the feeling of incredulity I am feeling right now. I NEVER SAID THE SOURCE WAS THE TALK PAGE! NEVER. NEVER AS IN NOT ONCE. Read what I wrote please. Actually read it. I said that I had previously stated the sources ON the talk page, not that the talk page was the source! You were correct in one case though. The source was not on the Collectors page, although it needs to be stated that the source does not need to be appended to the end of the sentence itself if it's already present in the references (which it now is). Please don't make things up and claim I said them, which we now know you just did, as you yourself admitted you lied about me insulting you. SpartHawg948 06:02, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * It wasnt so much of a lie as it was, horrible feelings boiling in my mind altering hte perception of my past to turn you into a worse person in my minds eye than you actually are (a lie). I think that you misinterpreted, what i meant was that the talk page shouldnt be hte page the sources are on, sorry my bad on that. But still you have yet to provide any proof that the collectors do experimentation of any sort. Speculation shouldnt rely on other speculation is my point, there should be an addendum to the speculation policy that states if speculation relies on otehr speculation it is no longer valid. Sorry, I get aggressive sometimes. And usually it takes me a while to calm down, i dont want to explain why I am this way it would take to long. But i am making an effort (mind in constant conflict) to improve, it just takes a while for me to get my head straight. ralok 06:09, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * Refer to the addendum to my most recent post in the section entitled "Can I come back now". I have nothing more to say to someone I cannot trust to not make up stories about me or who knows what else on a whim. If you were making an effort to improve, you would not be insulting other users and slandering them by claiming they insulted you in the past. Good day. SpartHawg948 06:18, January 5, 2010 (UTC)


 * The issue isnt my behaviour, the issue is the idiotic speculation on the collectors page. I diddnt make up that story i misremember. There is a difference, can you honestly say that you have never misrememberd anything, at least i admitted that i had made something up albeit inadvertantly. Just becaue my behaviour sucks doenst mean i am incorrect about how facts should be dealt with on this wiki. Its unfair treatment, thats what it is. You are essentialyl saying that because you dont like me that i am wrong, how does that work SpartHawg. ralok 06:23, January 5, 2010 (UTC)