This page is the third archive of my talk page. If you leave a message here, I will not read it beause I consider all conversations on this page closed. If you want to bring up an issue again, just leave me a message on my talk page about it. Thanks.

A Question

Are there any exceptions to the wiki's rule against using the word "you"? I have noticed a lot of articles in the "Articles Needing Cleanup" category have "you" in them, and I'm wondering if that's why. If so, I can easily repair quite a few of them. Arbington 23:39, July 4, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry had a 4th of July party to go to. Anyway, from my experience it is usually only allowed in the tactics section of the enemy pages, and in walkthrouhgs or guides. Main articles should be kept as if you are reading them on an encyclopedia, but those are the only two exceptions, apart from talk pages obviously, that I can think of. Lancer1289 06:14, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
I'm having a difficult time getting the enemies to pop up in the adversaries category where I want them too. Can you explain how I get them them where I want them? (i.e. Turian Bodyguard listed under T)AdmiralPedro1stFleet 03:16, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
I already fixed it. To do that just go to the bottom of the article and select the add categories button and type in the name of the category. Be careful as it is case senestative. Lancer1289 03:19, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
Why did you delete that trivial link about Tali? That has to do with her, does it not?Dagoth11 02:00, August 7, 2010 (UTC)Dagoth11
See your talk page for that answer, I will not repeat myself. Lancer1289 02:04, August 7, 2010 (UTC)


I for one would like to welcome our new Lancer overlord. Congratulations on your promotion! I have been wondering for a while (after I got over my first impression of you) why you didn't have at least partial admin powers. You definiately deserve them. Bastian964 22:22, July 5, 2010 (UTC)

Indeed, congratulations on the promotion to admin, Lancer. Arbington 22:25, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
Thank you to the two of you as well. As to a new overlord, well I wouldn't say that. :) Lancer1289 22:34, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
Lancer, just don't get a big head. You truely are the most vocal admin to the people now. MEffect Fan 22:37, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
Indeed and that is always something good to say to someone. One must be very careful to not let power corrupt one's self. Lancer1289 22:40, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
Oh come on. I leave for dinner and all this goes down while I'm gone? grumble. I'll echo the congrats! Earned many times over, it seems to me. Vandals don't stand a chance now. :) Dammej 23:01, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
Indeed and again thank you to everyone. Lancer1289 23:02, July 5, 2010 (UTC)
Congrats from me, too. One of the big-shots now, eh? -- Commdor (Talk) 23:47, July 5, 2010 (UTC)

Well, look at here now! After being away for a while and I see a new Mr Admin! Congrats, I'd must say! Teugene 06:30, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Congratulations, sir! I knew it would happen eventually :-) Fiery Phoenix 16:33, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
Good job, Lancer!Baron Von Awesome 17:39, July 19, 2010 (UTC)


Lancer. Can you please explain how to get the enemies into the Adversaries category? I want to help but I want to know what I'm doing. It would be much appreciated. Thank you.AdmiralPedro1stFleet 03:19, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

I already answered above but go to the bottom of the article and select the add category button to add the category and the Wiki will do the rest. Just be careful as it is case sensitive. Lancer1289 03:22, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
Thank you. I know I'm not the best with this kind of stuff, but if it's worth doing, it's worth doing right.AdmiralPedro1stFleet 03:30, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
No problem, always happy to be of help. Lancer1289 03:31, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Picture quality

What is considered too low quality to be used for displaying? I did some digging and could not find any minimum pixel limit so any edits I do wwould conform to the requirements. Thanks a bunch. GrandMoffVixen 02:59, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Its more of a visual presentation, if the picture seems grany, and in your case the picture looked squashed as well, then it really shouldn't be dispalyed. The picture you uploaded was grany as I could see the pixelation in it, and again the image looked sqashed. This one is more of a common sense rule. My policy with images is, if you wouldn't put it on an official document, like a school report worth 50% of your grade, something you'd give to your boss, or anthing along those lines, then don't put it in an article. Again though that is my policy so take it as you will. Lancer1289 08:06, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
I uploaded a new one. Tell me what you think so I can try again if it doesn't work. GrandMoffVixen 03:21, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
That is still a very grany image. The other major problem is the HUD elements in the middle of the image. We really want to avoid the HUD in screenshots, and I know Dammej has been very good about it. Either way, it still isn't up to the quality of other images, even when I shrunk it and played around with it as I could still see the pixelation. For good pictures take a look at Eclipse Trooper or FENRIS Mech or LOKI Mech article for good screenshots. The images there are the ones without any major pixelation and they are high quality images. Lancer1289 08:31, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Quarian Language

Hi, sorry I wrote the wrong info, but I found the answer about Keelah Se'lai on in the first post, and Tali says that in ME2 while on her loyalty mission.

Yea except there are no BioWare employees on that thread and most of the people are guessing at the meaning. A post by a non-BioWare person is some of the purest form of speculation there is. Again that is not a valid soruce becuase there are no BioWare people to confirm it and it is people mostly guessing at what it means. All of that forum is speculation, therefore not a valid source for information. We don't know, and neither did any of the people who posted on that thread, they all guessed. Lancer1289 09:33, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
Yup. Using that blog as a source, I could just as easily say that 'keelah se'lai' means 'don't drink the water' or 'die in a fire'. SpartHawg948 09:35, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict)Addendum: Also that specific post you mentioned, at the end the author closes with and I quote "My two cents", i.e. his guess, i.e. his opinion, which is speculation either way you put it. We don't know what it means and everyone there was guessing. Granted a well thoughtout guess, but still a guess. He also mentions phrases like "my guess" and "Hypothetically speaking", so it is again his guess, and not fact, so we don't know what those words mean. Lancer1289 09:39, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Shepard's new armor has a name at last

I just found a new pack that has both weapon and get this the same looking armor from the arc projector pic.

The Aegis Pack adds the M-29 Incisor sniper rifle and the Kestrel armor to Shepard’s armor locker. The Incisor sniper rifle is a burst-fire weapon that excels in destroying enemy shields. The Kestrel armor comes in five pieces: The Kestrel Helmet adds weapon damage, shield strength, and headshot damage. The Kestrel Torso Sheath adds melee and weapon damage and shield strength. Kestrel Arm Sheathing adds melee and weapon damage and shield strength. Kestrel Shoulder Pieces adds shields and melee damage. The Kestrel hip-mounted Power Pack ups shields and heavy weapon ammo capacity. Shadowhawk27 12:21, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

My appoloigies for not addressing this right away. As I couldn't sleep last night for whatever reason. I decided to look over my paper one last time, and to my shock I found a whole section missing and several edits gone as well. So I spent the last few hours fixing that. So to this new DLC pack. Lancer1289 14:08, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
It's ok, i know the feeling of lack of sleep :( By the way congrates on being the new administer to this site, you have my full support ;) Shadowhawk27 20:23, July 6, 2010 (UTC)
Thanks. Acutally the funny thing is I'm not all that tired. A quick nap about 3 hours ago and I'm fine. Maybe it has to do with the tea that I have been drinking all day. Lancer1289 20:49, July 6, 2010 (UTC)


Just noticed a possibly broken link on the monaco sidebar. Under Manual of Style, there's a link that literally says "Editing $1" that goes nowhere. We selling the space or something? :) Anyway, it looks like the link is broken, or more likely, we don't appear to have an Editing page in the Manual. -- Commdor (Talk) 21:38, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

I don't believe we are selling the link, or at least no one has told me so. But a dollar, I think we can get more than that for it. :)
Getting back on topic, you are correct in that is a broken link. I have since removed it because the redirect didn't work. So bye bye broken link. Too bad maybe we could have gotten some money for it. Lancer1289 21:45, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Slow down speedy

I appreciate that you like to bring up issues quickly, but would you consider letting the person that added a move tag to the article get the first word in on the discussion, to clarify their position? Seems like the courteous thing to do in my eyes. :) Dammej 22:08, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, used to people just posting delete, move, or whatever tags and then leaving it just like that and not opening the disucssion on the talk page. Lancer1289 22:11, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Jack romance pic

What's wrong with it?

How Can I Help?

Hey Lancer, you seem to know what's what on this wiki. I love Mass Effect so much I wanna help contribute. So are there any pages that need contributing (Note: I just created this account). Thanks! MEfan217 20:46, July 8, 2010 (UTC)

Well welcome to the ME wiki then. Anyway there are many was that anyone can help. First is to take a look at our Style Guide and Community Guidelines and read them over to get familier with our policies. A good place to look for something to do is the Article Stubs and Articles Needing cleanup cateogries. Those two categories are good places for anyones looking for something.
In general, just looking through the site and checking articles isn't a bad thing to do either. However before doing anything, do read though our sytle guide and community guidelines just so you are familier with our policies. Apart from the general advice to read over the guide and guidelines, just look around and anything that helps one article helps the wiki as a whole. Lancer1289 22:04, July 8, 2010 (UTC)
Maybe you can do a favor for me too, i've been trying to add this SFXGameContentDLC_PRE_Cerberus.SFXWeapon_CerberusShotgun to the PC Tweaks (Mass Effect 2) section Shadowhawk27 02:19, July 11, 2010 (UTC)
Hmm, becuase I really don't use all the mods when playing PC, I generally avoid the PC Tweeks articles, unless there is vandalism, because I really don't know where this goes. If you can post this on the talk page, if you haven't already, and I'm sure someone can add it when it is double checked. If it is already on the talk page, then post a new message and be specific about where it should go. Again I really don't mod my games on the PC, with one exception, StarCraft, so I'm not really of much help here. If you don't want to go to the talk page, Bastian964 has done a lot of edits to the article, so I'd recommend contacting them. Again I'm not really good with this so hopefully I have pointed you in the right direction. Lancer1289 02:27, July 11, 2010 (UTC)

Thank you

Thank you for the warm welcome. I have checked out both the style guide and community guidelines, so I'm happy to just use the wiki. Thanks so much for helping to make this wiki betterto use for all of us huge ME fans out there.


Well welcome. We all do our absolute best to make the ME Wiki the best and #1 place for all your Mass Effect related needs. Lancer1289 19:56, July 9, 2010 (UTC)

Blatant Vandalism by

Unregistered Contributer replaced all the text in Forum:Character_builds with what equates to nonsense. Bastian964 17:51, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

Already caught and taken care of. Thanks for being on the lookout. Lancer1289 17:53, July 10, 2010 (UTC)
No problem. Thank you for taking care of them. Bastian964 17:55, July 10, 2010 (UTC)
As you said, no problem at all. Lancer1289 17:57, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

Main N7 Picture

Sorry to bug you again but the main picture for the N7 Armor currently violate our minimize-the-amount-of-Shepard policy. It lacks a helmet. While there are two option for helmets we only really need to pick one because that picture doesn't need to show everything, like how it doesn't show the legs fully. Furthermore, the helmets are just variations of each other. Anyway, while the image does need to be replaced, unless someone thinks differently, I am unsure if we should leave it up until a new image is found or if it should be taken down immediately. Bastian964 18:09, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry dropped out for lunch. Anyway while it does violate the whole minimize thing, we don't have a better image right now. My opinion is to leave it up until we get a better image. Dammej has been taking a lot of armor pictures so I stuggest dropping him a line to ask for a new armor picture. I'd prefer one with the N7 Breather Helmet as that would almost certainly cut out most of the facial features. Lancer1289 18:34, July 10, 2010 (UTC)
No problem, I was clean so we were both busy. :) I have to agree about the use of the Breather Helmet. Anyways the line has been dropped. Bastian964 19:09, July 10, 2010 (UTC)
10-4, now I have to go fix a problem I had when I was editing. Curse having 5 tabs open. Lancer1289 19:12, July 10, 2010 (UTC)
Pic uploaded. Dammej 02:03, July 11, 2010 (UTC)
Nice job, Thanks Dammej. Lancer1289 02:06, July 11, 2010 (UTC)

I was wondering...

Hey, I've been working on another wiki recently, and it's been basically abandoned by everyone. It's really unorganized, so I want to create a character box template, but every time I try, it always turns out wrong. I must be coding it entirely wrong. So, I was wondering if you would know how to do something like that, or know anyone who does? Sorry to bug you about this, I just didn't know where to go. Thanks. --Effectofthemassvariety 23:12, July 11, 2010 (UTC)

Ok I need some info first before I know if I can help you, and I had my laptop closed becuse I was fixing my desktop, finally have my graphics cards sorted out.
Anyway the first question is really just because I'm curious, which wiki becuase I really just need a look?
Are you refering to the character boxs like the ones we have at the top of our character articles like Garrus?
If you can answer those two questions then I can help or at least point you in the right direction. Lancer1289 01:15, July 12, 2010 (UTC)

About the Illusive Man page

Is that why the latest post on the talk page was how you dragged it off topic and that the info should be there? CAW4 15:03, July 12, 2010 (UTC)

I dragged it off topic, well that's a stretch. I pointed out that saying the Illusive Man's eyes are similar to Shepard's cybernetic implants implies that the Illusive Man's eyes are cybernetic, which is of course speculation. You said I put words in your mouth, which I didn't, and you brought the topic further off course by focusing on that falseality. I never put words in your mouth and saying that I did is incorrect. Also by wording it by saying Cybernetic Implants, which is how you wanted it, implies that the Illusive Man's eyes are cybernetic, which is again speculation, and as pointed out by Spart on the talk page.
You said I lied, which is false as I stated myself clearly, you questioned my integrity, which I take as an Insult anytime that happens, and that is where the discussion got off topic. You are the one who accused me of lying, and defended that, rather than focusing on topic, no matter what anyone else said. You are quick to violate our guidelines about language in just about every post, and since you direct all of that at me, I take it as a further insult. The discussion got off topic because you focused on one thing I said, and blew it out proportion, which is where it got off topic. You are very quick to insult me, throw rude language in my direction, or call my integrity into question in just about everything I do. Which seems to me that you have it out for me just because I don't agree with you and your views on what is and isn't trivia, despite president, our guidelines, and despite multiple other users agreeing with me that it isn't trivia.
As to the trivia, bottom line, for reasons already stated it isn't trivia. Lancer1289 16:35, July 12, 2010 (UTC)
When every single post has you saying speculation and I'm just trying to get you to quit saying that, I'm sure as hell not the one bringing it off topic. As I said many times, I was not in any way, shape, or form trying to have anything at all like that in there, and you keep saying that I am, you are lying.
I take it as an insult when people put words in my mouth, which was exactly what you were doing, and once again you are lying. After I called you out for lying, you never responded afterwards. I never tried to force that you were lying, I asked you to stop saying I was speculating, since I had said multiple times that I was not in any way saying what you were accusing me of, and even offering to allow anyone to format it how they wished, which you completely ignored to focus on saying that I was speculating.
I have not violated the language policy since my ban expired, nothing I have done has gone against the language guidelines, which you would realize if you read them. And the reason that it's focused at you is because you do nearly nothing for the wiki. You remove useful information, and the average amount of edits you make that add something are only about 5 per 500 edits.
And it got off topic because I focused on what you said? I told you to drop it but YOU kept repeating speculation like it was a fetish. You may have started off simply misinformed, but after I've said directly to you twice that that was not my intention and that I was fine with having my edit formated you are lying, or you are simply not reading my replies.
And your 'reasons already stated' are about the equivalent of 'it doesn't count.' Your arguments focus on either 'unnessisary' (Which is a bs cop out excuse), or 'speculation' (which, for reasons already stated, is lying). Get an actual reason for going against it. CAW4 19:13, July 12, 2010 (UTC)
Didn't violate the language policy huh, "And now you're just making shit up." "THE SAME DAMN GAME" "JUST. FUCKING. STOP." "Wow, really? Keep trolling, since apparently all you and lancer need are your undo buttons", "trolling", "Which is a bs cop out excuse". Six examples of you either violating the language policy or insulting other users. You have again insulted me becuase you said I lied when no one else says that I did. You accued me of putting words in your mouth, which I didn't, and lying, which I didn't also. Remember that people can disagree without getting hostile, which you do every time someone disagrees with you.
I read you replies and all you kept doing was insulting me and calling into question my integerity, which I again take VERY serisouly. You clearly haven't read my posts becuase I explaned, and Spart did as well, why I said what I did.
As to my undos end my edits, I have done many things to make this wiki better, more than 80 edits as you claim, so you again insult me. I undo things when they go against policy and our guidelines that you are so quick to break or ignore. You seem to patrol my contributions looking for an excuse to bring something up that was either fixed or undone becuase of said policies.
If you would read our speculation policy, you would realize that most of the edits that are undone by Spart, Myself, and other users, is pure speculation and doesn't warrent a place in the articles. They are all valid removals and if you would read the policy then you would see why.
As to my apparently reasonable excuse that you have again violated the language policy again on, I felt that I didn't have to repeat what Dammej and Bastian964 already stated. I gave my reasons and they are in line with what other users have said so why repeate them. Lancer1289 19:37, July 12, 2010 (UTC)
The language policy states that offensive language is not tolerated in articles, which I've never done, or against other users which I haven't done either. Using foul language is not completely restricted, and the times I've used offensive language so far have not gone against the language policy. You really should read it before trying to use it against someone.
I only said you lied once, and after I said that you never responded again. You are lying by saying all I was saying was that you're lying. That...that's just...really?
And because you keep saying you explained why it was removed, let's look at what you said
1) "Speculation" and "not enough to justify trivia" (both seem to be your buzzwords, and there was nothing that showed any reason for it to be removed)
2) See #1
3) Only "not enough to justify trivia" (again, no facts or anything that isn't in the eye of the beholder)
4) Not having seen the dev interview that I referenced and "speculation"
I'm not joking or exagerating, it's there for anyone to see right on the Illusive Man talk page.
I don't look for just your edits that remove valuable pieces of information, I'd put valuable info back in no matter who removed it, but you're the person who does almost all of it. Don't blame me for what you do.
I've read all the policies, there's little you (un)do that's warranted by those policies. Your arguments are little more than 'I don't like it, so it's gone.'
And once again, I'm all for coincidental similarities being removed. But when the similarity is something that's in this game, nothing from outside it, and what causes the similarity was added withing the same game and has the camera focus in on multiple times throughout the game, it's nowhere near coincidental. CAW4 00:16, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
And you are arguing that I remove things I don't like, which is a completly false. There is a lot that gets removed when I want it to stay, but we have guidelines for speculation and the like, which you don't seem to understand, don't care about, or think that everything should be in the trivia secitons that even hints at a similarity. 1) + 2) Again speuclation becuase of the cybernetic implants. Saying that TIM's eyes are similiar to Shepard's cybernetic implants, is implying that they are cybernetic themselves, which is speuclation. I explaned that, and tried agin in my second respone. 3) To Quote Bastian964 "Either this trivia counts as "Coincidental similarities" or it is speculating that there is some significant reason for the alleged visual similitarity between the Illusive Man's eyes and Shepard's implants. Neither of which are allowed as trivia." 4) Your dev interview states that the eyes played a part in the creation of the character, and nothing more. We don't know what they ment, and you seem to want to put words in their mouths, or interperit their words to suit your own needs. Either way that is SPECULATION, which isn't allowed.
My undo's are perfectly justified and would have been done by other users, had I not gotten to them first. Speculation isn't allowed, and "Coincidental similarities", aren't trivia either.
As to the lying, I stated why I said what I did, using the word IMPLES multiple times. I wans't lying becuase I wans't putitng words in your mouth. I stated that saying they resemble Shepard's cybernetic IMPLIES that they are cybernetic. Which is of course Speculation. I used imples becuase it avoids me lying and me putting words in your mouth. Get your facts straight and look at it from an outside perspective. Read it, with the cybernetic implants, and tell me that you don't see that implying that the Illusive Man's eyes are cybernetic. That is speulcaiton, which isn't allowed, nor are visual comparisons, which as pointed out by Dammej, "The pattern is not the same. Renegade shep has solid red pupils with 3 small dots in the iris. The illusive man has a circle that goes around the pupil, 3 much larger circles in the iris, plus arcs between each of these circles" they are similart, i.e. visual comparison, i.e. not trivia. Your only support is that dev interview that you keep coming back so which you twist by putting words into the mouths of the devs, to suit your own needs. We don't know what they ment by them saying that a lot of work went into TIM's eyes. Becuase we don't know what they said, it is speculation and therefore not trivia. I have given you reasons that this isn't trivia and you still argue that it is, which is completly against our policies. Lancer1289 00:44, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
CAW4, face facts. You have violated the language policy several times since your ban expired. Lancer demonstrated as much above. Stating that you have not violated the policy in the face of evidence to the contrary is a lie. And we know how you feel about lies and people who tell them. SpartHawg948 19:55, July 12, 2010 (UTC)
Once again, I advise you to read the policy. It was not in the article, nor was it directed at another user. It would be against the language policy to say "eff you" or "You are _____," but using language is not instantly against the language policy. Every time I've used it, it is being used as an adjective or adverb to show intense emotion.
If you want to keep talking about the language policy, use my talk page, I don't want this going off topic as the original one did. CAW4 00:16, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
I will admit, you are correct. Your language thus far has not violated the language policy. I was mistaken. Your language thus far has actually been in violation of the banning policy. Several specific infractions are listed as things that can result in a ban. Among these is "Crude or offensive language". This is taken straight out of the Community Guidelines, which I advise you to read in their entirety before asking that others do the same. And again, I have at least three examples of violations of this policy by you since your ban expired. "And now you're just making shit up." "THE SAME DAMN GAME" "JUST. FUCKING. STOP." Clear-cut violations of the banning policy. SpartHawg948 00:25, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
The banning policy is an overview of what can get you banned. It's essentially another heading for the language section which I have not gone against (Compare it to

law. There are overviews such as 'Killing is illegal,' while it gets further explained and things such as killing in self defense aren't illegal.) CAW4 01:44, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

Ummm... no. You know why? Because in the law, there are overviews, but when there are said overviews, there are also detailed accounts of what is and isn't excusable. Here, that is not the case. It's black and white. The banning policy is not an 'overview', it is the policy in its entirety. To modify your analogy so that it actually works, the law is 'Killing is illegal'. No ifs, ands, or buts. Self defense? What's that? Please don't try to argue this with the person who (as it just so happens) is the arbiter of these policies. You won't win. An overview can only exist when there is something more detailed for the overview to summarize. And that isn't the case here. So no, it's not like the law. Please do two things for me. 1) Start following the policy. 2) Come up with analogies that work. SpartHawg948 01:52, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
I'll delete the language policy section then, since everything within it is rendered moot by the banning policy.
And since I'll be editing, I'll add in the Illusive Man's eyes, since you have nothing in terms of arguments and have twice simply driven the topic off topic and stopped caring about what was supposed to be discussed. CAW4 02:13, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
And how about that is only to be edited by admins and and people with admin permission, which you are neither. Also the tircia isn't trivia and I have explianed why, LIKE YOU ASKED, and you apparently didn't read it. So that isn't my fault becuase I did not derail this topic, I explained and responed to your comments, and you apprarently didn't read them. I gave very valid reasons for why it isn't trivia and you either did read it or ignored it. See all of my posts before accusing me again of derailing the topic, when you did. Don't accuse me of doing things I didn't. Lancer1289 02:23, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
And now you're just making shit up." and "JUST. FUCKING. STOP." were directed right at me becuase I disagreed with you, which falls under insulting behavior towards another user. Ok so maybe ti was the banning policy, but you still violated policy and insulted me in the process. Lancer1289 00:49, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
Saying "you're just shit" or "fuck you" would have been violations, these are not.
Once again, if you want to discus the language policy, do it on my talk page, don't derail this topic. CAW4 01:44, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

Uploading videos

You know how to upload videos? I can't for the life of me figure out how. All I want to do is upload this (the Mass Effect Story So Far video BioWare released about the time Overlord came out) for use on the main page (this stems from my project). It's an official video, so I think it meets Community Guidelines standards. -- Commdor (Talk) 23:45, July 12, 2010 (UTC)

Ah well the rule is, no videos, see the Mass Effect Wiki:Community Guidelines, General FAQ, last item for more. However if you allow me to modify your page, then I can get that video into the page. We use the embedded feature, but again it will go quicker if you allow me to mod the page, and then I can explain it. Lancer1289 00:02, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
Permission granted. -- Commdor (Talk) 00:09, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
Done. Ok as to now as how we embed videos. We embed vidoes using the <youtube>(URL of Video)</youtube> command. Just replace the (URL of video) with the actual URL, and the video and Wikia will do the rest. There are a few other parts, but I really don't understand them. Anyway that's embedding videos 101. Lancer1289 00:19, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
Alrighty, thanks a bunch. -- Commdor (Talk) 00:25, July 13, 2010 (UTC)


"I believe that bug was removed before, a few times now"

Do you mind if I ask why? It is most certainly a bug, and if it has been removed several times, then obviously multiple people have reported it, which many people would consider confirmation of its existence.

Because, to quote one of our other admins, SpartHawg948 on one removal, "Given that addressing female military officers as 'sir' is fairly commonplace in sci-fi (reference the re-imagined Battlestar Galactica for a prime example), can't say for sure its a bug". And I tend to agree. It isnt' a bug because we don't know that it is. Lancer1289 02:57, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

dreadnought numbers

How can the number of Asari dreadnoughts be 20 either way? If the Destiny Ascension is saved, there is no mention of another Asari dreadnought being destroyed or decommissioned. This has to be an error on the part of Bioware.

Aside from that I would be interested to know where in the game it confirms that the Asari lose a dreadnought if the Destiny Ascension is saved; I have always saved the Destiny Ascension and haven't found any mention of dreadnought numbers other than the Codex, unless the problem was overlooked by Bioware.

It isn't confirmed in game so to speek but in the Codex. See Codex/Ships and Vehicles. We were able to confirm that the Codex says 20 either way, whether or not the Ascension was saved, and since the Codex is Law, and the ultimate source of canon information, if it says 20, then we say 20. Just becuase something isn't mentioned doesn't mean that it didn't happen. Lancer1289 13:20, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
Also remember rame race caps, asari, turian, and human are common nouns in the ME universe so they are here and are lower case. See our style guide particularly our naming conventions for alien races. Lancer1289 14:35, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

"...since the Codex is...the ultimate source of canon information..." That may be, but I wouldn't blindly obey a source just because it says so. It is probably just an oversight by Bioware, who wrote the Codex in the first place. Can the inconsistency at least be mentioned in the trivia section? Until definitive proof is furnished that the asari lost or decommissioned another dreadnought while the Destiny Ascension was saved, I won't believe that the Codex mentioned number for Mass Effect 2 is anything other than a mistake by Bioware, it just doesn't make sense. The Codex was written by humans after all.

Well, saying that it is a Bioware mistake is as much a speculation as saying the dreadnought is lost/decommissioned. As you said, proof is needed for saying that the asari could have lost/decommissioned another dreadnought, so proof is also needed for claiming it is a Bioware mistake. That's why neither of the 2 possibilities are mentioned anywhere. Teugene 16:16, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict)Yea how about the Codex doens't have a trivia section for a good reason. And noting it in the starships trivia section is unwarrented becuase we don't know that it is an oversite. Also the Codex is the ultimate source of canon information and unless there is evidence to the contrary, like on the Graybox page, it is FACT. Again just because we don't see it happend doesn't mean that it didn't whcich is what you are arguing. The games and books can only cover so much, and who is to say that the asari didn't decommission a dreadnought or lost another in the span of two years, becuase both seem very plausable.
Just because the Codex was written by humans doesn't mean that it is a mistake. We have a confirmed case where it is a mistake, noted above, but maybe BioWare indended that for a reason, oh maybe to avoid saying that the asari have 21 dreadnoughts if you saved the Ascension, and 20 if they don't. They worte it that way for a reason, and until we have evidence to the contrary it isn't noteworthy because the Codex is law. Lancer1289 16:22, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
Until we have proof one way or the other, we can't say anything more. The Codex says 20, and yes we will "blindly obey" it becuase the Codex is from a canon source and again until we have prof one way or the other we can't say that it is an oversight/mistake, or that the asari decommissioned a dreadnought or lost one in the mean time. Either way is speculation. Lancer1289 16:25, July 13, 2010 (UTC)
Which is what was already stated by Teugene. Again until we have proof, we can't say anything either way becuase it is speuclation, which isn't allowed. Lancer1289 16:27, July 13, 2010 (UTC)

Asari Consort

Is there any written proof beyond your speculation that she lives there?

Saltpeter1 13:42, July 14, 2010 (UTC)

Considiering a few things here. It was up there for well two and a half years, it was like that when the article was created as a matter of fact, before you changed it, and being passed over by two adimins several times, they tend to agree. Normanlly becuase he is a consort, i.e. a fancy name for a prostitue, and considering she runs a more fancy version of a brothel, and considering what her private quarters looks like, it is very logical to assume that she lives there. And many people agree with that. Also considering the fact that the second person to edit the page, an admin, left it like that after she edited the page to add more detail. THere is enormous president for this and from the evidence, she clearly lives at her place of business. Which also has historical backup as well. Lancer1289 14:09, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
Just as another note, I lost track of the amount of times that this was passed over by editors and admins alike. Lancer1289 14:12, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
Your right. I trust you that it is where she lives but no matter how many admins or users agree it's still speculation, remember when I changed the article about Sgt.Haron and you changed it because you didn't know it was him, well sure I was speculating but isn't this about the the consort speculation too? I understand that there is some indirect evidence that suggests the consort lives there, but Sgt.Haron's face tatoo's match in the two cutscenes so isn't that indirect evidence too? The only difference between the two is that admins looked over the consort article.Saltpeter1 14:35, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
Wait just one second, now you are saying that you agree that she lives at the Consort Chambers too? Because I am very confused now. There is a large amount of evidence both in the universe and outside the universe that give support to claim that she lives where she works. Also several admins and other editors agreed with that statement in there was enough evidence to support that claim. The majority has ruled in this manner, considering it could have been changed by any number of editors, and yet it wasn't. Lancer1289 15:15, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
Lancer lack of change is not a good defense for not changing something now. I have to agree with Saltpeter that it is speculation to say that she lives there. They might we called her "Private Chambers" but it's a brothel that's a pretty obvious name for them. Would you want to live where you worked if you ran a brothel? Do we actually have any statement that says she lives there? If not then changing it to 'works' isn't such a horrible thing and removes absolute any possible speculation. Bastian964 17:47, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
However in history, women who ran brothels did actually live there, granted it wasn't where busisness was done, usually, but they still lived there. However I can see I'm on the minority side of this argument so if you want to change it back fine. Lancer1289 18:08, July 14, 2010 (UTC)
But Lancer as I said I agreed because she probably lives there but it's still speculation and why does human history about prostitutes living in there brothels matter? The asari are aliens so there prostitutes might not live in there brothels, it's a likely assumption that she lives there but again there's no proof and the fact that human prostitutes live in there brothels is not valid since asari arn't human.Saltpeter1 01:52, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
History matters because it put the universe in context. BioWare had to get their ideas from somewhere, so putting htings in context matters. Works is fine becuase it setteles the matter so why keep arguing at this point. I consider this matter closed. Lancer1289 02:02, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
Ok thanks for accepting "works", it's apreciated
Saltpeter1 02:08, July 15, 2010 (UTC)

Policy forum

Congrats on becoming an admin by the way. I've had a look now, and it definitely seems like an interesting idea, though I'm rarely active enough to contribute a great deal. Phylarion 16:51, July 15, 2010 (UTC)

Well thank you as well. As to you not being active enough, anyone that makes a positive contribution, or anyone visiting for that matter, can still voice their opinion. After all this is a colaberative project so anything positive, whether it be a comment about a policy, or an edit to an article, helps. :) Lancer1289 16:55, July 15, 2010 (UTC)

Eternity edit

If it's not trivia, then put it somewhere else instead of just completely erasing it.

How about it doesn't belong anywhere becuase after finally sorting out my graphic cards, and figureing out the fly cam feature, against my better judgement, I couldn't reproduce this result on my game. I even tried this on my 360, just to cover the bases, and I still couldn't see anything that you don't see, more clearly, when the camera gets close to Tali's face during normal game play. There are the white eyes and they appear to be set against black skin, or at least from my perspective. So for that reason it doesn't belong anywhere because it can be seen elsewhere, without mods, or moving the camera angle to just the right angle. Also putting it in the quarian article wouldn't be good either becuase we don't know if that is what they look like, or if is just another placeholder image. So again, it really doesn't belong anywhere. Lancer1289 21:57, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
Sorry, I thought that happened because of the way the Quarian moved back and forth. Sorry for the speculation, it's probably just a placeholder.
(edit conflict x2) You also have to understand that in most cases (such as this one) the 'if it's not trivia, put it somewhere else instead of erasing it' method is just plain impractical. I mean, where else should it go? And why? Most things that get removed because they aren't trivia are removed because they have no bearing whatsoever on the topic. If we include this bit, next we'll have to include that Vulcan Station may be named after Vulcans from Star Trek (which it obviously isn't), or that krogans are like Klingons and asari are like Vulcans (neither are true), or include the names of every fictional ship from every sci-fi genre named Cerberus or Sovereign. Some things just don't need to be in articles, and this was one of them. SpartHawg948 22:04, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
  • Addendum- also, please remember, it's quarian, not Quarian. SpartHawg948 22:04, July 15, 2010 (UTC)

Ok I get it, and that was just a typo.

Just making sure, since this 'typo' also appeared in the trivia item in question. SpartHawg948 22:09, July 15, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict x3)Oh that's how you did it, well that I have experienced and that is what I see when you move the camera in the same motion across Tali's face, and even when it zooms in close during some of the romance secitons. If BioWare could just release an image, or even a vague description about what quarians look like, we can settle this debate. However something tells me that either they won't until ME3, or never. I do like the mystery they provide however so I guess I really can't complain.
(edit conflict x3)Also do watch your name race caps, quarian, asari, human, etc, are all lower case due to them being common nouns. Sorry but the good editor, or admin, still getting used to that, hat never really comes off. Lancer1289 22:11, July 15, 2010 (UTC)


The prisoner being interrogated is not the same prisoner who sends the email. The convict who sends is the email is called Billy, the convict being tortured is called Bimmy. I was removing an incorrect fact.

And yes you would be correct on that, and after digging through the history it was added by someone then just overlooked. Oh well my mistake.. Then I guess the quote thing is my only complaint. Lancer1289 18:15, July 17, 2010 (UTC)

More Sidebar stuff

Just a couple things, I think you can fix them all at once whenever we finally get the proposed Series article out there. Under "Mass Effect Overview", there is still a link to the now-deleted PC version article. Next, under "Mass Effect Series" and "Mass Effect 2", I believe the link to N7 Armor needs to be changed to Armor Customization now that we have all the armor parts there. Uhhhh... that should be it. I think. Got one of those tip-of-the-tongue thoughts I can't place. -- Commdor (Talk) 18:29, July 17, 2010 (UTC)

Well see if you can think of that other thought. Anyway I can remove the PC version link, but I have to say that the N7 armor link stays. Mianly becuase it is the only armor players have access to without DLC so having that link is a very good idea. I can add a link to the armor customization option, but the link to the N7 armor should stay. Give me a minute. Lancer1289 18:35, July 17, 2010 (UTC)
Done. Lancer1289 18:36, July 17, 2010 (UTC)

Sovereign - 'We' vs 'I'

It is a fact that Sovereign always refers to itself as an individual "I am Sovereign and this station is mine." "I am beyond your comprehension." In contrast to Legion who referes to itself as a group "We are all Geth." "There is only we." despite the fact that both entities contain many AI programs. This is something that should be mentioned somewhere in the article on Sovereign, and if not in the trivia section, I would be very interested to know where. 20:16, July 17, 2010 (UTC)

It doesn't belong anywhere. It is dialogue and as I stated in my edit summary, we don't know how other Reapers refer to themselves. We also have only one other snythetic race to compare them too, or rather one other synthetic unit. Dialogue, or how someone says something, isn't trivia especially becuase we only have two comparison points. Dialogue isn't mentioned in articles for a reason, we have subpages for squadmates, but otherwise it isn't noteworthy. The fact that Sovereign referes to itself in the first person, while LEGION, refers to itself as a group, isn't noteworth becuase we know how the geth function, while we don't know how the Reapers function. One progarm in Sovereign can be in control of the comm system, another enginnering, and the progam in the dialogue system says "I" for whatever reason. Bottom line, it isn't belong anywhere becuase its diaogue, we have very little to compare it to, and we don't know how the Reapers function, while we know the geth are a collective intelligence, like the Borg. Lancer1289 20:25, July 17, 2010 (UTC)


I re-added the [sic] in the Purgatory article, because its doing exactly what its job is: Indicating that the misspelling of Shepard as "Shepherd" exists in the original email from the game, as is not the result of an error in transcription. I'm not saying BioWare made an error. I'm quite certain that they intentionally had this unknown person misspell Shepard's name in the email. But people visiting this site won't immediately know that, and may attempt to correct the error. Having the [sic] tag next to the name lets them know "oh, that's how it is in the game". Basically, it'll save us having to make hundreds of undos for people mistakenly correcting it. -- Dammej (talk) 08:58, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Your edit summary said it all. However I am used to seeing [sig] next to something that needs a fact check, so a little ignorance on my part to also not know what that ment. So thanks for fixing that and I guess I've learned something new today. :) Lancer1289 09:01, July 19, 2010 (UTC)
Just wanted to elaborate I guess. I actually thought you'd already retired for the night, so I wanted to leave a more thorough explanation just in case. Guess it wasn't needed. :) Cheers! -- Dammej (talk) 09:11, July 19, 2010 (UTC)
Nope, can't sleep for some reason, maybe it was the 5 cans of soda and the 20+, I lost track, cups of tea that I had. Or maybe I don't want to fall asleep as I slept most of the weekend, especially while my Internet was out on Saturday. Anyway so I guess I can do something in the mean time. I don't have class today until 7:00 pm so I can take a nap during the day if I need to. :) In case no one has figured it out yet, I have a very weird sleep schedule. Lancer1289 09:15, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Intergalactic Distances - Dark Space

The Milky Way galaxy is 100,000 light years in diameter and 1000 light years thick. Galaxies are on average millions of parsecs apart, one parsec equal approximately 3.26 light years. The number of stars in a galaxy ranges from as little as ten million to as much as a hundred trillion in some supergalaxies. If galaxies were only a few thousand light years apart, the gravitational pull of so much stellar mass would cause exponentially more galactic collisions and would tear galaxies apart. Such events, if they occured as frequently as the thousand light year error implies, would be cataclysmic for the galaxies involved, and on an astronomical scale, highly noticeable. The Milky Way has dozens of satellite galaxies, the closest of which is the Canis Major dwarf galaxy at 42,000 light years from the galactic centre; this is probably where the error originates. Only three of these orbiting galaxies is less than 100,000 light years wawy from the Milky Way, the other are several hundred thousand to over half a million light years away. But even these distances are unusual in that they are at the far end of the spectrum of galactic distance, the Andromeda galaxy for example is approximately 2,500,000 light years away.

The claim that galaxies are thousands of light years apart is ludicrously unrealistic. Scientists and astronomers, with the help of high powered telescopes - both space based and ground based - estimate the avaerage distances to be millions of parsecs. I was correcting a false fact on the Dark Space article page.

No you are not correcting a false fact here as it has been proven outside of Wikipedia that the CMDG is 25,000 LY away not millions. Putting millions imples that a greater distance exists, when the nearest is a mere 25,000 LY away. Galaxies are close together and since all of the Milky Way's satalites are within 300,000 LY, then millions is inappropiate as it is incorrect. There is proof and evidence for the current way the article is pharsed, so stop chaning it back and note you are in edit war territory now, which is a bannable offence. Lancer1289 10:23, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

I suspect that you are being deliberately ambiguous with the distance of the Canis Major dwarf galaxy. The CMDG is 25,000 light years away from our solar system, and 42,000 light years away from the galactic centre, since we are discussing galactic distances it would appear that the latter distance is the relevant distance, but even this is unusually close. Furthermore, I never said that the CMDG was millions of light years, and it is concerning that you attempted to imply that I did. Having said that, even if we discount all but the galaxies within 1 megaparsec of the Milky Way (the limit your wikipedia list is based on), those galaxies that are tens of thousands of light years away are at the far end of the spectrum and very much in the minority. The rest of the galaxies on the list are hundreds of thousands to millions of light years away. Even then, we could discount all but those galaxies that orbit the Milky Way; only three, including the CMDG are less than 100,000 light years away, the others are close to half a million light years away.

If you can't bring yourself to recognise millions as the most realistic average, at least change the Dark Space article to say hundreds of thousands, or if you insist to tens of thousands of light years, since I am sure even you would agree that 1000s is far too short a distance, even for the CMDG.

Please also note that the correct spelling of 'satalite' is satellite. Minor errors are forgiveable when touch typing, but obvious spelling mistakes like this look sloppy and second rate, and it is hard to take seriously someone who cannot spell properly.

And when someone starts point out spelling errors that occur from typing quickly, then the converstaion starts driting off topic. Anyway would you say you had millions of dollars if you only had say 500,000, no you wouldn't because it would be inaccurate, which is what his debate is about, accuracy, NOT averages. Also take this to the talk page in question. Lancer1289 10:58, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough, as regards pointing out spelling mistakes, but you have failed to answer the rest of my message.

Becuase this is about the Dark Space article where this should be discussed as I said in my last comment and where I have answered and provided back up. I don't like to repeat myself as I have answered where it is more relevent, however I'll just copy paste what I just wrote. And when you say tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands you imply 10,000 - 99,999, and 100,000 - 999,999 respectivly. Both of those are innaccurate as there are galaxies that fall outside both categories. Thousands has been used in places where tens and hundreds isn't appropiate, like this case. Thousands is more accurate and saying anything else is implying something else, when thousands has worked and is the best fit for this situation. It is also used to descibe distances beyond what yoru definition of thousands says. Examples: The Earth is thousands of miles in circumfrance. The Moon is thousands of miles from Earth. And I can go on all day. Bottom line is thousands fits better and is more accurate. Lancer1289 11:09, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Your analogy between the Earth's circumference, the distance to the moon, and the distance between galaxies is a weak one. While it may be the case that units of distances are sometimes used to denote distances greater than the actual definition, there is a reasonable limit to how far one can stretch these definitions, otherwise language begins to lose any real meaning. The difference between 1000 light years and 100,000 light years is too great to be taken seriously by simple logic.

You have insisted that accuracy is the subject of this debate, and yet you also insist on using an inaccurate figure to denote the intergalactic distances when 100,000s or even 10,000s is more accurate. Furthermore, whilst you may reasonabely take liberties in describing the circumference of the Earth (24846.5992 miles), you cannot honestly expect someone to believe that the Moon is thousands of miles away when it is actually 238,857 miles away, tens of thousands is more accurate with respect the lunar distance though ideally one should say hundreds of thousands. Similarly, the most accurate average galactic distance with respect to the Milky Way's orbiting galaxies is in the 100,000-500,000. Therefore, hundreds of thousands is the most accurate description, and tens of thousands if you wish to take liberties, but thousands is plainly false.

Again why isn't this on the Talk:Dark space page, instead of my talk page, where this conversation belongs and where this should be discussed. And you want us to use your definition of thousands, which seems to contrdict many other definitions, see that talk page. Lancer1289 12:05, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

One final message before I leave your talk page, it is not MY definition that I would see used, but the most accurate and representative definition - representative of scientific truth, not of various interpretations of it. You clearly don't care about accuracy at all as far as this discussion is concerned, though you have falsely stated otherwise.

But that's your business.

And yet everyone else seems to agree that thousands is acceptable. That's all I'm saying. Lancer1289 12:17, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Argumentum ad populum is a hollow argument, that's all I'm saying.

And this a community project, i.e. the majority rules, and the majority has decieded that thousands is acceptable. Again that's all I'm saying. Lancer1289 12:29, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Sovereign Unique Dialog

Hey Lan, what's up? Everything good?

I just wanted to ask you about this unique dialog page for Sovereign? I mean seriously? Sovereign really doesn't have that many lines to say. It only has a relatively small number of lines (which are totally epic though), which means that that unique dialog page will essentially include everything Sovereign can say in the game, voiding the idea of "unique" dialog completely.

I hope you can see my point here. Just an observation, nothing more. I think that article is entirely unnecessary. It's not like anyone will miss Sovereing's lines anyway; they're all very obvious to get -- unless they are horribly unobservant. Fiery Phoenix 14:08, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Well it is up for deletion and just as long no one adds a link to the article proper, then I think in, what 5 days, or is it 6, the article will be deleted. The thing is it isn't a spam article, or something that can be required for deletion immediatly. While yes it's basically the conversation, we still have to wait the appropiate time, unless Spart wants to overrule me here. We had to follow the same procedure for the Sarah Williams article as many others. Personally I'll be glad when its gone.
However I think the person who created it tried to get around the policy of nnot adding dialogue to aritlces, which, onsidering the day it was created, is probably from an argument with me. The problem is that none of it is unique dialogue, but we still have to wait the seven days, less now. Lancer1289 14:15, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Hm... We'll see then. Fiery Phoenix 14:20, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

I don't think deletion will be a problem becuase we are already at 3-0. Lancer1289 14:22, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Removal of Your Comments

Unregistered contributor has removed your comments from their talk page a grand total of five times. If this isn't blatant vandalism I don't know what is. Bastian964 17:12, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

That is his talk page, so he is free to do what he whishes with it. Any person is free to remove comments from their own talk page, and nothing more. The things you miss when you duck out for a few hours. Lancer1289 18:58, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Small favor

I need you to go here and tell me how many images you see on pages 1 and 2 of that article. -- Commdor (Talk) 22:00, July 19, 2010 (UTC)

Ok Let's break it down by browser.
IE8: I see 1 image on page one, with three red x, probably images that can't be shown for whatever reason. ON the second page, I see one as well, with yet another red x.
Firefox: One image on either page, the same that are shown in IE8.
Chrome: Same as IE8, just with different, "I can't load images" button.
Safari: Same as IE8 and Chrome, but again different button.
Again you have peaked my curiosity as to your question. Lancer1289 22:08, July 19, 2010 (UTC)
Must be a problem on the site then. I had that article bookmarked for months and wanted to get some of the concept art off it, never got around to it. It showed an alternate Omega-4 galactic core base-thing, there were these islands with parkland on top in open space with Reapers settled on them. It looks I've missed the window to get that art, though. -- Commdor (Talk) 22:13, July 19, 2010 (UTC)
Hmm, yes I guess it must be. I noted that article way back in February, when the images were still there apparently, but didn't save any of them. Anyway I'd recommend contacting Gameinformer about it and see what they say. My theory is that BioWare, or more likely EA, noticed the art, and asked them to take it down. That's one of my theories. My other theory is that Gameinformer only had access to the images for a short time, and that time has since elapsed. Anyway those are my theories so take them as you will. Lancer1289 22:18, July 19, 2010 (UTC)


The issue with Expat is that we don't even know the actual name of the character. If we did, I'd let it slide along with other questionable volus such as Jahleed and Pitne For (remember, known and notable are not the same), but we don't even know that much. And, IIRC, you actually can have some informative conversations with the hanar merchant, learning about hanar culture and such. And, again IIRC, no such conversations exist with the Expat, as he is more properly referred to. SpartHawg948 06:59, July 23, 2010 (UTC)

Hmm granted, although it is in the subtitles IIRC, but anyway considering all you can talk about with him is the situations on Noveria and Feros, and how his merchant from the latter hasn't reported in yet, I can see your point. Lancer1289 07:01, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
Sorry to butt in. Question. When talking about notability is it notable in-universe, or notable to the player? Personally I think it should be the latter, but that's irrelevant, I'm just curious what we're using. JakePT 07:24, July 23, 2010 (UTC)
Ummm... yes. Honestly, it's more so notable to the player. If it were in-universe, President Huerta, Speaker Ford, and Prime Minister whats-his-face would be notable humans. Same for the mysterious Councilor Tevos. Well, actually, Tevos would be a notable asari, not a notable human! :P By either standard, the Expat would seem not to qualify. I should also point out that the admins have never really discussed this, so this is kind of a 'seat of the pants' thing. SpartHawg948 07:27, July 23, 2010 (UTC)


So, in light of the recent edits to the Destiny Ascension page, I decided to do one of my fact-finding trips. Occasionally, when I see a registered user making a fuss, and that user has a fairly distinctive name, I'll Google it, see if I can see what those people are up to on other wikis. It's helped me catch a few vandals and troublemakers and such. Usually, I don't learn anything surprising, as was the case this time. Some people just seem to make friends wherever they go. SpartHawg948 04:54, July 25, 2010 (UTC)

I do that too when an editor continues to make a fuss about something, but usually if they continue to do so over multiple issues, like User:CAW4 for instance. I can remember a few other times where I have done this, but I can't remember them off hand at the moment, and like this one, you do discover some interesting things about people and their attitudes. Lancer1289 04:59, July 25, 2010 (UTC)

On a related (and belated :P ) note, not sure if you noticed or not, but did you happen to see Sentenal01's most recent edit to the Fish page? This one was quite a while after the Star Trek nonsense, and was what I like to term a 'tantrum'. Sentenal01 was apparently protesting the Star Trek info by adding some more info that was supposedly related, either to demonstrate the absurdity of the Star Trek bit or to try and start clogging the page with silly trivia so that it all got removed. Whatever the goal, it was a silly tantrum which failed, but it was good for a chuckle or two. :) SpartHawg948 04:00, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Yes I did see it and it did give me a chuckle. The Trek references have at least some basis, but that one had no basis in fact, as it was more of a name trivia than anything. You also pointed out that fish tanks are rare in scifi, and again TNG and ME2 are the only two instances I can think of. Lancer1289 04:03, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Main Page Project

My main page project is finalized and I plan to present it to the rest of the community for discussion later today, barring any last-minute adjustments. If you've got any last words to say about it, I direct you here. -- Commdor (Talk) 19:41, July 25, 2010 (UTC)

Shepard's Gender and the His/Her Issue


I believe this has been discussed before, but I haven't been able to find a link to the discussion. In any case, what is the Wiki's stance on the his/her issue? A lot of the articles seem to automatically refer to Shepard as a male. Is this even right to do?

I'm not really asking for anything here, other than that you fill me in on this (or send me a link to an already-existent discussion), because I have zero concept where we stand on it. Also, though off-topic, I apologize for the non-trivia I added in Thane's and Samara's loyalty missions articles yesterday. I should have known better. Fiery Phoenix 12:56, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Well since BioWare has yet to say that Shepard is male or female, we follow suit. We use the Commander, Shepard, or any other way we can to avoid saying him or her outside of romance sections, which are the only exception. See the style guide for more on that rule. But out of curiousity where are are you seeing this becuase if it is a problem, rather than just some typos, then it does need to be addressed. I really could use some article links. Lancer1289 15:08, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Off the top of my head, Grunt: Rite of Passage is one article which refers to Shepard with "his" on more than one occasion. If I remember/find more such articles, I'll let you know. I've seen this several times in a number of articles before, but I was never sure what to do with it. Fiery Phoenix 15:23, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Yes I do see that, and it needs to be fixed ASAP. We avoid using Shep gender references outside of the romance sections for obvious reasons. Lancer1289 15:38, July 26, 2010 (UTC)
Addendum: If you do come across any more, please fix them. Lancer1289 16:02, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Affirmative. I'll just replace the his/her with a "the" from now on. If necessary, I can even rewrite a sentence so it fits both genders. Just wanted to know where we stand here, because quite frankly it kind of annoys me when I see people referring to Shepard with "he" or "she" and their extensions on the Wiki as if they were posting on a forum. It just isn't right. Fiery Phoenix 16:06, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

No it isn't but do watch how you reword sentences as replacing "him" or "her", or any other variation of that, might not work all the time. If possible use "the Commander" or "Shepard", or reword the thing, because again we do need to keep it gender neutral outside of the romance sections for Ashley, Kaidan, Jack, Miranda, Tali, Jacob, Thane, and Garrus. As those squadmates can only be romanced by a member of the opposite gender, "he" or "she" is ok there. Romance sections for Liara, Samara, Kelly, and Morinth however, need to be kept neutral as they can romanced by both genders. Lancer1289 16:10, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, I gathered that. Don't worry, I know how to deal with it. I hope other editors are aware of this, though. Fiery Phoenix 16:15, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Yea we try and fix as we go but unfortunatly a lot of these slip through the cracks. I know PikaShepard does go around fixing these things, and others get them if they come across it. However again this is something that does slip through the cracks. Lancer1289 16:20, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

'Spreading out' the template

Since you asked, here's my theory.

I think that the rich text editor that's enabled by default does that. Templates show up as puzzle pieces, and clicking on the puzzle piece allows one to edit how the template is called. I think that, in the process of saving, it does that default layout where the name of the template and each of its parameters are on separate lines. Usually it doesn't affect how the template displays, but there are exceptions. Just my theory, anyway. -- Dammej (talk) 23:47, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

And this is why I hate the RTE with a vengence, it messes up formatting, and the DA wiki has banned it entirely. When you look at the code it messes is up. Also it has been known to completely mess up formatting, which just causes problems, and is a pain to fix. Again I hate the RTE with a vengence. Lancer1289 23:52, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

That was weird,,,

Hey Lancer,

About the Tali: Treason edit I just made, according to your subsequent summary I actually SIGNED my edit. Is this for real? I mean I took a look at the previous version of the edit and it appears my username was in fact there!

I don't know why or how the hell it happened, lol, but seriously I'm sorry. I was honestly kind of distracted while I was typing that one note so it's very possible that I mistakenly signed my edit. Really. This is so embarrassing. I hope I don't do something incredibly stupid like this again. Fiery Phoenix 17:14, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

Well you probably just hit the signature button as you were saving the page, so I take it as one of those "doh" moments, or a typo which ever you prefer. So just an accidental mistake, ho harm done. Lancer1289 17:24, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, let's just hope it doesn't happen again. Hah. :D Fiery Phoenix 17:38, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

Indeed. Lancer1289 17:41, July 27, 2010 (UTC)


Both the Phoenix Massing and Shrike Abyssal are locations, though. As far as I'm aware, encyclopedically, the only time where article words should be in titles is with works of art, publications, novels, and so on. People, places, and things don't get that luxury. You sure the MoS stipulates that locations are so protected? Even at Wikipedia, nebulae and whatnot don't have "The" in titles either. -- Commdor (Talk) 23:03, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

While yes you do have me there, however it comes to naming conventions. Becuase they are actual names, as provided by screenshots of the clusters, we can't move them. After all, the Omega Nebula doesn't have the word "The" in the title, and the same can be said with any other cluster as well, Attican Beta, Local Cluster, Pylos Nebula. Because these have the actual word "The" in the title, they have to stay that way. Lancer1289 23:10, July 27, 2010 (UTC)
It should be no different than with the Illusive Man, or the Pleiades. "The" is still not part of the actual star clusters' names. Furthermore, there's this Illusive Man email, where the Phoenix Massing cluster is also referred to with "The" de-emphasized in-game. -- Commdor (Talk) 23:18, July 27, 2010 (UTC)
As to the Illusive Man, don't forget when Shepard first meets him, they say "Illusive Man", not The Illusive Man. As to the email, it is in my opinion a typo, but that's speuculation. However, when it comes down to it, we follow the more supported version, which is in this case, the screenshots which show "The". While screenshots for the Omega Nebula and other clusters do not show "The". I don't know if it is an oversite, but because tjhat is what they are called that on the Galaxy Map, and while traveling between systems in a cluster, The Phoenix Massing and The Shrike Abyssal is what we call them as well. Lancer1289 23:28, July 27, 2010 (UTC)
Well alright then, no budging you. I continue to disagree, however. I'm at least going to make redirects without "The" for the sake of convenience. -- Commdor (Talk) 23:40, July 27, 2010 (UTC)
I have no objections to that. If they weren't called as such on the Galaxy Map and in the in-game screenshots, then it would be a different story. Lancer1289 23:43, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

Claiming ownership of comment

Hey what's up Lancer and how's things there? So while I looking around this wiki, I was just wondering about your revert that caught my eye. As I see it, technically, the user Doctalen isn't editing the comment, rather, is claiming ownership of the comment which was (possibly) made during when he/she is unregistered. Tell me if I'm wrong, but these edits usually never gets reverted nor it is bannable because it is not an offense of owning up as the original poster the comment (unless it is really done by another person) nor it is a necessity to logout-edit-login back just to claim ownership. I remember it had happened many times in this wiki by accident or when we forget to log in (I was a "culprit" once) and we never need to do something like that. Also if I'm not mistaken, I think admins has a way to check the IP prior of an account used to register. So the revert/warning just seems pretty harsh for something which good faith can be assumed. Teugene 07:23, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

While I do assume good faith, the comment was edited by another unregestered IP, and then Doctalen, so I have no idea if either one is the original poster. If it had just been Doctalen, then I wouldn't have done anything, because as you pointed out this has happened before, but since there was another IP who edited the same comment, I just couldn't be sure. Also I'm not sure about checking IPs of users, if that is a feature then I haven't discovered it or no one has told me about it yet. I do have a way to check IPs, as we all do, but I'm not sure of a way to check IPs of users. Lancer1289 07:46, July 28, 2010 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure only Wikia staff can check a user's IP. At least, according to Special:ListGroupRights. I doubt it's something that they (Wikia) will do on a whim, either. -- Dammej (talk) 07:55, July 28, 2010 (UTC)
Which is probably a good idea when you take a second to look at it. Sometimes it would be nice to do that, but I think the privilage is Wikia's becuase I can see it being abused even at the admin level. While I'm not saying that any of the admins here would do that unless there was a need to, on other wikis I can see it being abused. And for all we know it was initally an admin privilage, but then it did get abused so they made it a staff only power. Just speculating here. Lancer1289 08:03, July 28, 2010 (UTC)
@Dammej, thanks, you found the page I was looking for. Looks like I'm wrong about checking a user's IP. I'm assuming it based previous users bans, where the user and the IP it was used to register gets banned in the same time. Could be a Wikia auto-function. Teugene 08:12, July 28, 2010 (UTC)
Yes Spart has a story about that and Wikipedia but you are correct. When a user gets banned their IP(s) get as well. Also If an IP gets banned any user who uses it gets banned. Say for example if I do vandalism under my IP and that gets banned, when I log in the next time from the same IP, I can't to a thing becuase it banns my username as well. Not say I will do that, but it was the best example I could come up with at the time. This is also why talk page privilages aren't removed because if there was a misunderstanding, then it can be corrected. Lancer1289 08:19, July 28, 2010 (UTC)
You managed to dig at the issue I was attempting to be caged about, Lancer. Guess I'm a little more transparent than I thought. :) I had thought of mentioning potential abuses of the Checkuser function, but had decided against it. Giving it to users of the wiki is a convenience that isn't really needed, and has the potential to be grossly misused. Needless to say, I think that Wikia has made the wise decision by reserving that power for their staff. Gotta say you've piqued my curiosity with the mention of Spart's story, though. I sense an 'innocent victim' somewhere in there... -- Dammej (talk) 08:33, July 28, 2010 (UTC)
Yes innocent victim is a very accurate story. See Spart's talk page subsectaion CAW4 and scroll down a little to where I aslk about talk page privilages, the story is right there. Or just click here. Lancer1289 08:46, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

Featured users?

Hey Lancer,

I was touring the Wiki recently and came across this page:

Some of the editors I know are there (like you), but also a lot of the other editors aren't listed. I also saw a number of people's names who I haven't seen before. Question is, what "defines" those people? Like, what would it take to be a featured user? And do they get some kind of preferential treatment, if that's the right expression?

Just curious, really. I didn't realize there was such a thing until very recently. :) Fiery Phoenix 16:58, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

It's based on the number of edits a user makes. Also NO they do not get any kind preferential treatment, as every user here is treated the same and held to the same rules. Finally, make more edits to be a featured user. Lancer1289 17:03, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

Really? That's it? I didn't think so, because user Snfonseka seems to have less edits than I am and yet he's listed on there. Or is it the "quality" of edits? Sorry, but I'm confused somewhat, lol. Fiery Phoenix 18:03, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

Lancer's correct, yes. The reason you don't see yourself ahead of that user is because that page is cached. They only scrape the database to generate that list every so often (I don't know the time period). There could be other components, like edits to talk pages not counting or something, but I haven't investigated that. Rest assured that you'll be on the list eventually. -- Dammej (talk) 18:07, July 28, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict)I don't know about that but it can take several days for the cache that controls it to update, or whatever it's called. It took a while for it to reflect that I had higher edits than some users, sometimes several days. So quality, I don't know, but it does take time. Lancer1289 18:21, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

I figured as much. It didn't look like a page that can be edited manually to me. Thanks for the replies, guys. Fiery Phoenix 18:29, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

Just saying, the page can't be edited manually. Lancer1289 18:35, July 28, 2010 (UTC)


Thanks. And do you have Ascension, too? I got Spart looking for his copy to verify how old Grissom is in that book. If Ascension says Grissom was exactly 70 years old, then we will have irreconcilable continuity problems. Yay (naw, I'm really bummed by the prospect)! The only possible way issues can be avoided is if Ascension either does not say how old Grissom is at all, or if it isn't exact about his age ("He was almost 70" etc.). -- Commdor (Talk) 00:12, July 30, 2010 (UTC)

Just had a quick listen to the audiobook. "Her father was a difficult man to love. Grissom was approaching seventy, and unlike most people in this era of modern medicine..." from chapter two. FridgeRaider88 00:17, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
While it may seem redundent it is from chapter 2, page 22, paragraph 2 opening sentence. Wow that's a lot of 2's. Lancer1289 00:20, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Thinking about it...from a timeline perspective this doesn't actually make sense as if he's approaching 70 during Ascension, and Retribution is 3 years later (though he dies 6 months earlier aged 75), then it doesn't fit. FridgeRaider88 00:21, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Personally I think it's one of two things. 1) The age in Ascension is incorrect, or 2) its just an oversight. I can't say for certain. Lancer1289 00:24, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
(Double edit conflict (I must take too long typing or something)) At least that's cleared up. It's vague like I wanted, but not the kind of vague that would have helped. "Approaching seventy" to me means he was younger than 70 at the time of Ascension... Whatever, it ain't concrete so I'm ignoring it. Grissom died in 2186, there, we're done with this. Thank you FridgeRaider. -- Commdor (Talk) 00:26, July 30, 2010 (UTC)

getting annoying now

please stop just changing everything i post, there is nothing wrong with the information i have posted. i would like to keep this from going to the official monitors.

The official monitors? You mean like Lancer1289? SpartHawg948 20:17, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
ah that may be a slight problem but there is also probably a complaint box for the staff.
And why would we need to get the staff involved? I expained in every edit summary why the information was either uncalled for or unnecessary. I think I was pretty clear on that. Lancer1289 20:21, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Yeah. If you complain to the staff, you know what they'll do? Tell you that issues like this are not their concern and kick it back to the admins. And you're talking to two of them right now. And if 1/2 of the site's admins agree that there is something wrong with the info you're posting, maybe there is. SpartHawg948 20:24, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Considering you just beat me to the latest revert Spart. Lancer1289 20:27, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
I'll be gone for a while (going to the DMV... hooray! :{ ) but I trust you'll handle this as you see fit. I'm not too concerned about the edit to my page (hey, it was a compliment, at least), so just keep an eye on things and act as you see fit. Later! :) SpartHawg948 20:41, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Yea but I still had to give the warning. Anyway I had a good time at the DMV myself yesterday, getting my new driver's licence becuase I turned 21. For reasons why see here. I really hated the Illinois under 21 drivers licence. Also I had to renew becuase my licence expired in October so two reasons. Lancer1289 20:46, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Ohio, where I used to reside, now does the same thing with licenses for under/over 21. Long story short, there's an hour of my life I can never have back. I went in, waited for about 20 minutes, got some paperwork to fill out, realized I'd forgotten to bring my birth certificate, and went and got my vehicle inspected to get it registered, as it's still got Arizona tags. The inspector didn't like a political bumper sticker I have, so the entire time she was inspecting it, she was lecturing me about how wrong I am to support a particular candidate for governor. She finished, and told me that per a new state law, I now need to get my truck emissions tested. Up to January, it had been exempt, but now even diesels need to get tested. So I get to go back here soon. Fun fun. SpartHawg948 21:57, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Ouch, well all I can say is that you have my sympathies for that. Good luck doing the rest of the paperwork and running around in order to get your vehicle regestered and driver licence if you need it. As to the inspector, I really try and stay out of political debates as they usually go nowhere. I have my views, you have yours, so lets agree to disagree. Which is something that she should have done. Again politicl debates, let's just agree to disagree. Lancer1289 22:04, July 30, 2010 (UTC)


You have no idea how relieved I am to see that I'm not the only one who doesn't like the idea of putting videos and 'fan/social group' sites in the squad mate articles. I removed the Samara one, as it was the only one of (what, 13?) that had such a section, but then when I saw the Jack ones added, and remembered that you'd just bumped the text up on the Samara one, I started having doubts that maybe I was being too stodgy (as if there is such a thing!). I'm just worried that if we allow a couple of videos, people will want to start posting any and all videos, and ditto for 'fan sites'. I know I have the same 'domino effect' worry with many things of this nature, but it seems valid to me. Anywho, it was just nice to see that I'm not just some crazy old coot yelling at the kids to get off his lawn. Or, if I am, at least I'm not the only one! :) SpartHawg948 22:12, July 30, 2010 (UTC)

I just left a message saying as such on the User's page. Please fell free to read it and add to it if you feel necessary. Also I can see the domino effect about videos, so that was my second reason, and my sluggesh memory and the embedded text thing was the reason I didn't rmeove it from Samara's page. Also I really don't like the notion of social groups/fan site links, as this is an encyclopedia, not an advertisement for anything except the Universe as a whole. Personally I like Garrus, Thane, Wrex, Legion, and Kasumi the best, can't pick a favorite, but if I was forced to, I'd say Wrex. And I thought there were 17 squadmates in total, 6 from ME, and 13 from ME2 with 2 repeats? Lancer1289 22:23, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Gotcha. I was just talking ME2 squad members. I didn't bother looking at the ME ones. And yeah, for ME2, it's 13 total, with a max of 12 in your squad (due to Samara/Morinth). I added a bit about the addition of links to fan art sites and such on the Aria T'Loak page, noting that 'fan' anything has no place in the articles. SpartHawg948 22:26, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Added to it that we really don't need links to those places either, which is what you said mut I felt also needed to be said again. We will link to other sites when necessary, for sources and such, but otherwise its just BioWare's main site, and nothing else. Plus with our no association with the fan fiction sites, promoting social groups on BioWare's site, just seems like to be violating that rule, and needless self promotion. As I'm pretty sure that the person in question is a fan fiction and social group type of person who is promoting their work and groups. Lancer1289 22:30, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Now back to watching Death Race, recent version. Lancer1289 22:31, July 30, 2010 (UTC)

Unused Galactic News in ME2

Hey Lancer, how have you been?

I just thought I'd send you this video posted here:

It features a remarkable variety of unused galactic news in ME2. I don't know, but I thought you might be interested to hear it all. Also note that this has absolutely nothing to do with the Wiki -- just a friendly message to show you something. That's all. :) Fiery Phoenix 21:39, July 31, 2010 (UTC)

Indeed very interesting. I am wondering why some of that didn't make it in, oh well it was quite interesting so thanks for passing it my way. :) Lancer1289 23:28, July 31, 2010 (UTC)

Sidebar suggestion

While you're working on the sidebar, may I offer another change suggestion?

Since the Armor Customization article pretty much covers everything that used to be handled by the N7 Armor article, wouldn't it be more appropriate to link to both "Armor" and "Armor Customization" rather than "N7 Armor" and "Armor Customization"? Afterall, more armor exists in ME2 than just N7 Armor. Obviously the Armor link would jump straight to the ME2 section of that article. Just a thought here. -- Dammej (talk) 19:39, August 1, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry to keep you waiting but I wanted to get the rest of it done first. The only problem with that is becuase the N7 armor is the default armor, and the only one accessable without DLC, so when this conversation came up before, cant remember where right now, I believe that was the reason for linking the N7 Armor. I can add a link to the armor as well to ahve it go to the ME2 section. Just need to get Spart to ok that. Lancer1289 19:57, August 1, 2010 (UTC)
Well, right at the very top of the ME2 section of the Armor page, it does note that the N7 armor is the default armor Shep starts out with, so I don't see a problem with changing the link to 'Armor'. SpartHawg948 20:17, August 1, 2010 (UTC)
Alright then, I'll change the N7 Armor link to Armor#Mass Effect 2. Implementation in a few minutes. Lancer1289 20:19, August 1, 2010 (UTC)
Wow that went faster than I thought it would, anyway it works. Lancer1289 20:21, August 1, 2010 (UTC)

Overload/Neural Shock

Can a reference be made to ME1 talents that grant the same abilities? It's useful for those who have played ME1 but not ME2.

First what is ME1? There is only Mass Effect, Mass Effect Galaxy, and Mass Effect 2, so what is Mass Effect 1? Second talents are different from powers, Electronics and Overload, and Medicine and Neural Shock are complely different. Electronics grants other abilites in Mass Effect, while Overload doesn't. Electronics increases shield strengh and increases hull repair on the Mako, while the Mako bit is redundent in ME2, people see that and think that Overload does the same thing, which it doesn't. Also they have different stats, like range of effect, recharge time, weapon overheat in ME2, which doesn't happen in ME to name a few. The same principal applies for Medicine and Neural Shock. In ME, Medicine decreases the time it take for medi-gel to become available and using the ability attached costs accuracy to the opposing player, both of which do not happen in ME2. Stating that they are similar is only in the names, the effects of the powers are much different than the abilites given by the talents and making a mention for someone who is just looking at the ME2 article for the first time, would give the asumption that they are the same, which is incorrect. The abilites in ME are only a part of the talent, while in ME2 they are more refined and have differnt stats and results. Lancer1289 06:25, August 2, 2010 (UTC)/////////////////////////
Please note that I included a specification. I wrote that the power is comparable to the ability granted by the respective talent. Hence it is made clear that while the passive boosts (to shields and such, as you have mentioned) are not comparable, the abilities of Overload and Neural Shock--comparable in names and effects--are indeed. Can a compromise be reached? It would be nice.
Next time, please do wait for an answer to your question before changing the thing you asked a question about, it was very rude that you didn't wait to see what I would say. To your second question, becuase the abilities are different form the powers and their effects and results are different. If it were the same name like throw and warp, then it would be a different story. But because they aren't it changes the story. Some people are more familiar with the talent name rather than the ability name, and of course others are more familiar with the ability name, however, they are new becuase you do not acquire them with any additional parts or strings attached. Making the mention that they are similar to the ability isn't really good becuase people who haven't played ME2 yet, and have only ME, then they will probably assume that they do the same things which isn't the case, which is why it is structured the way it is. Lancer1289 06:37, August 2, 2010 (UTC)////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Ok, I'll register and at least make the reference on the articles for overload and neural shock (at the bottoms in the applicable sections). I'll make it very clear that the passive boosts do not apply, but that the effects are similar (overloading shields/paralyzing organics). Sorry about before for editing before reply.
*cough* AI Hacking has been there for a while, and it's not from Mass Effect. It's an ability granted by the Hacking talent in Mass Effect. I don't really have a dog in this fight, but I think that whatever applies to neural shock and overload should be similarly applied to AI hacking. -- Dammej (talk) 06:46, August 2, 2010 (UTC)
Nvm about my edits, I see the references are already there (For the mass effect talent, see: etc).
(edit conflict x2)Just to note that there are already notes on both pages at the top saying that for the Talent see _____. There is no need to make a second note when there is one very large one at the top already. It is basically redundent information. Lancer1289 06:49, August 2, 2010 (UTC)
What of Dammej's comment, then? Should AI Hacking be moved to the "new" category as well, since the ME talent of "Hacking" is different from the ME2 power "AI Hacking" and confers different bonuses? For example, "Hacking" in ME reduces recharge times for Overload, Damping and Sabotage. To avoid confusion as you have suggested, it is logical to move it. Paragatorade 06:52, August 2, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict)No becuase it was done that way for a reason. They are complelty different, AI Hacking lasts for a much shorter time than Hacking does, and Hacking also imporves other abilites while AI doesn't. They are different, do different things, have different stats, and have different names. Lancer1289 06:59, August 2, 2010 (UTC)
As to the move, yes I would have to say that would be a good idea. I'll take care of that. Lancer1289 07:00, August 2, 2010 (UTC)
Good, we agree. I'm glad something came out of this. I'll go change some spelling errors or something to avoid full-scale war :P
This probably wasn't the kind of thing that would escalate into a "war", but since you said spelling errors, just mind our spelling policy about US and UK spelling. We allow both and a change to one or the other isn't allowed. Well yet another discussion that productivity came out of, I wish there were more of these. Lancer1289 07:11, August 2, 2010 (UTC)
This has come up before; while administrators demand UK spelling, the wiki itself seems to be running US spell-checking software. Somebody either needs to switch the software or put up a big notice on the front page so someone passing by doesn't accidentally screw up the British spelling upon seeing those little red dashes under the words when they make edits in source mode.Kalaong 00:00, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
I believe that you are refering to your browser because wiki doesn't have spell check as far as I know. I know Chrome and Firefox have spell checkers that do it for you, but as to put a notice on the front page, that is overdoing it by a long shot. Lancer1289 00:03, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
There is a button on the upper right corner of the input window, under the word Controls. It says Source. Hit it and it shows the source code of what you're editing. That turns on an integral spell-check. For example, on your post, it has little red dashes under "refering". I guess that's the UK spelling of the US word "referring". If that's site policy, people need to know. A list of alternate spellings would be really good - this is my favorite wiki and I don't want to get booted for something like that.Kalaong 02:25, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
And yet another reason I hate the Rich Text Editor, thanks for helping me add yet another excuse to my list of why I hate that thing. I don't use the RTE, but to list all of the alternate spellings would be just huge because there are many minute differences between UK and US English. What I have found that if you are in doubt, then use a online dictionary like, or something like that. As to my misspelling, is just a misspelling, not a UK spelling, I sometimes type too fast. I'll look at it on the RTE, but this is exactly why I hate the thing, it does things that we dont' know about. As to getting booted, that is unlikely as we usually just drop a reminder, again if in doubt, check. After a while, you start to pick up on the spellings, colour vs color, armour vs armor, etc. Lancer1289 02:35, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
Sorry to jump in here, but your initial response was 100% correct, Lancer. Wikia does not provide spell check. It's all done in the browser. By clicking the "view source" button, he switches to the plain text editor that you and I use. In most modern browsers (I know that FF and Chrome do this; I'm not sure about IE), these boxes have spell check enabled. There's absolutely nothing we can do to make someone's browser switch between UK and US english spell checking-- that's something they'll have to do themselves. -- Dammej (talk) 02:49, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
No need to appoligize, I am always looking for input. Anyway I have discovered the same thing that its the browser and how it converts the source code, which is nice. However sicne I do use IE, it doesn't have this feature, sometimes its annoying, but we all like what we like. Maybe I'll convert some day, but not today. Also I have left a message on Kalaong's talk page confirming my thorughs, which you just backed up, so thanks. :) 02:59, August 5, 2010 (UTC)

Categories for deletion

I suppose I should have just done this in the first place, but I've found a few categories that should probably just be deleted post haste. On the Special:UnusedCategories page, they're ME2: Infiltrator guide, Forum:Unique Dialogue, and Volus Planets. I'm not sure about others on the page, but those 3 in particular caught my eye as being pointless. -- Dammej (talk) 06:24, August 3, 2010 (UTC)

Well the thing is they may be pointless but we well have to wait the 7 days, unless Spart wants to overrule me here. Once next Monday rolls around, I'll be happy to get rid of them. Lancer1289 16:51, August 3, 2010 (UTC)

Block policy?

Hey Lancer, I just wanted to express my concerns with a particular block you've made. After an anonymous user made this edit, you reverted it, calling it vandalism, then blocked the user. While I agree that the edit was probably not in the best interest of the article, it certainly didn't look like vandalism-- at least not the kind that would warrant an immediate block. All of the information added to the article was accurate, just poorly worded or unnecessary; that is to say, I believe the edit was made in good faith. I imagine the all caps "YOU MUST STOP HIM..." addition is what lead you to believe it was vandalism. Now I understand wanting to block users who make repeated unhelpful edits to articles while not listening to advice, but this was a first-offense block, which seems particularly harsh, given the rather innocuous nature of the edit.

I don't mean to unfairly criticize you or tell you how to handle blocking of users, but I nevertheless feel the need to make it known that I feel like the block was unnecessarily harsh. I wish there were a more discreet way to contact you about this; the email I used to register is not one I wish to use for communication on the wiki. I hope you'll understand that I have the best interests of the wiki in mind here, and that I'm contacting you in good faith about it. Thank you for your time. -- Dammej (talk) 20:46, August 4, 2010 (UTC)

You might have missed the rest of the all caps part which stated "OR HE WILL INFECT EDI!!!!". That is what I considered vandalism. It was completly unnecessary, and considering the context, was vandalsim. Granted Spart and myself probably have different definitions about this, and he can override me on this, in which case I'll no doubt get a talking too, but I have seen edits before where vandalism is hidden in the context of a good edit. Again if Spart want's to overrule me he is more than free to do so, as am I with him, but I feel that was vandalsim in the context of the articl, ewhile the rest of the edit could have been easily fixed. Lancer1289 21:20, August 4, 2010 (UTC)
I did not miss it; I omitted it from the quote intentionally (hence the ellipses), since I didn't feel the need to quote it verbatim, especially since I had linked the edit in its entirety earlier in the paragraph. You and I clearly have different ideas of what vandalism is, so I'll not mention it further. -- Dammej (talk) 21:35, August 4, 2010 (UTC)
I'll happily offer opinions, but I'm not overruling another admin on matters like this. I'm all for a unified front on the part of admins on this sort of thing. If someone sees that they can get around one admin's decision by running to another (not in any way implying this is what you're doing, Dammej, just laying down my reasoning on this) then that's what they'll all do. Providing an opinion in private is one thing, overruling (and undermining) another admin publicly is another, and I don't go in for that sort of thing. SpartHawg948 00:11, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
That's perfectly understandable, SpartHawg. I've found myself in a similar position (Though not on a wiki, merely a society at University) so I can happily agree with that policy. Like I said, I would prefer to have contacted Lancer in a more discreet manner about this, so that it didn't look like I was trolling for an overrule. Perhaps I should consider changing emails (if that's possible...) -- Dammej (talk) 00:19, August 5, 2010 (UTC)


The second and third lines seem out there to me. The second may be worth keeping; I just get this vibe that it's incredibly irrelevant (okay, both asari squaddies are purebloods... what of it?). The third one says "asari" is the name of an Egyptian god or something. That's nice to know and all, but it strongly implies that the devs got "asari" from the god, and such a connection has no source. I thought about removing them myself, but they've been up this long so perhaps there's a reason for them. I wasn't sure, so I left a note in the edit summary.

P.S. Have you been getting massive lag too? It has to be site-wide. A little annoying.

P.P.S. Server lockdown has been preventing me from saving this comment for a while now...

P.P.P.S. While I'm here, thought I'd bring MediaWiki:Anonnotice to your attention. It's said "Mass Effect 2 has been released!" for six months now, and maybe it's time we took that snippet down. -- Commdor (Talk) 03:17, August 5, 2010 (UTC)

So it isn't worth noting that all asari squaddies thus far are purebloods, a stigmatized rarity among that species? I beg to differ. The Egyptian one I could take or leave. On another note, someone's in trouble... Lancer put a new notice on his talk page earlier about just this sort of thing. Silly Commdor! :P SpartHawg948 03:22, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict)Ok yes on the system lag, yes on the lockdowns, and yes it is getting very annoying. The second I can see keeping becuase it is a bit of trivia because it has been hinted that purebloods are rare in asari society in the modern day era. Also I can see it worth noting becuase the fact you haven't had a normal asari, produced from an offspring with another species, which is hinted that it is rare in 2183/5, is worth noting. However I don't know about the third bit, maybe I'll drop Spart a message about it. Finally about the Anonnotice, maybe when I drop that message, I'll ask about that. Lancer1289 03:29, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
The note thing is recent and I'll let it slide for this one, but I really do hate cross page conversations. Anyway I really don't care about the third one. Lancer1289 03:31, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
You've been getting that lag as well? I was wondering what was up with that. I thought it might just be me, but if someone else is getting this, it definately has to be wiki/wikia wide. Arbington 03:33, August 5, 2010 (UTC)
Yea its wiki wide and it is really getting annoying. Lancer1289 03:36, August 5, 2010 (UTC)

William C. Dietz

Hey Lancer, I don't know if you know or not, but William C. Dietz has confirmed that he will be writing more books after Drew Karpyshyn, link below! 00:00, August 6, 2010 (UTC)

I am aware of it and we have that linked already on the Books page. However Dietz says he's only writing one novel not multiple so we have that reflected on the page in question. Lancer1289 00:03, August 6, 2010 (UTC)

Edits to Jentha

Sorry, repost; still getting used to the wiki. Have a good day, Flippantelf 16:32, August 6, 2010 (UTC)

Ok then, enjoy your day as well. Lancer1289 16:35, August 6, 2010 (UTC)

MP Heading code

Hey, I plan on implementing the main page update soon. I'd appreciate it if you went ahead and inserted the monaco.css code from my page into MediaWiki:Monaco.css so the new heading bars are ready once I push the big red button. I'm aiming to do it in the vicinity of 12am UTC (i.e. in about 20 minuntes).
Also, would this update to the main page be news-worthy? We could use a couple more events in the Wiki News section and I think this might be appropriate. Thoughts? -- Commdor (Talk) 23:42, August 6, 2010 (UTC)

Ok just one question, does it matter where I put it or not. And I think it would be ok for the wiki news. Also just as a pice of advice, mention it to Spart as well. But please do get back to me on the css code. Lancer1289 23:45, August 6, 2010 (UTC)
It shouldn't matter where it goes, the section on there labelled "PAGE" might be the best place for it for organizational purposes. But wherever it's placed, it should kick in immediately once you save it. -- Commdor (Talk) 23:50, August 6, 2010 (UTC)
Ok give me a few seconds then. Lancer1289 23:51, August 6, 2010 (UTC)

M-6 Carnifex Trivia

"Large" and "great" in the context of the word magnus refer to power and strength, not size. It is the Latin root word from which "magnum" is derived. GiantEnemyCrab 02:34, August 7, 2010 (UTC)

Except Magnus is also a name and one definition you didn't list was "important", which isn't relevent to the M-6. Just because something has a definition in a different language doesn't justify it as trivia, and this is no exception. Just becuase it is a root word doesn't mean that other definitions apply. Lancer1289 02:38, August 7, 2010 (UTC)
Just because one definition doesn't precisely apply doesn't mean the others don't. Many words have multiple definitions. In this case, "magnus" seems to be a reference to the weapon's power. Why else would it be on the side of the gun? GiantEnemyCrab 02:42, August 7, 2010 (UTC)
So then we should include every definition of every word then, becuase that is what you are suggesting, in which case start listing names. Large and great are very vague even when referenced, and because of that it isn't trivia. It could refer to its range, or its size, which is large for a pistol. They are too vague to list. Lancer1289 02:45, August 7, 2010 (UTC)
No, I'm suggesting common sense be used to determine why a certain word is used in regards to a certain weapon. Magnus is obviously not a reference to a name, as that makes little sense, nor is it a reference to the gun's physical size since that would be an improper use of the word. However, if you wish for it to remain unmentioned, I will defer to your rank as admin. It is not important enough to keep arguing about. GiantEnemyCrab 02:57, August 7, 2010 (UTC)

Vanguard Guide - Armor Piercing Ammo

But the section makes no mention of extra damage to health. It only mentions an increase to armor damage, something incendiary ammo already does. It also inaccurately lists that the vanguard has no powers to deal with armor, and mentions barriers even though armor piercing ammo does no extra damage to them. If extra health damage is the only concern, then Shedder Ammo would be the more relevant ability. Armor Piercing ammo is an unneccessary power to list in a vanguard guide due to its redundancies with incendiary ammo. GiantEnemyCrab 03:43, August 7, 2010 (UTC)

Redundancies? Incendiary and armor piercing ammo are two seperate things and do seperate things. Armor Piercing ammo does extra damage against health and armor, while incendiary ammo does fire damage. If you would look at the pages, AP ammo actually does more damage than incendiary ammo. I have also found AP ammo to be useful while playing as a vanguard. If something isn't listed, then wouldn't the better thing to do is add it rather than just remove it altogether? If you notice something missing, don't remove it, how about adding to it. I'll fix it. Lancer1289 03:52, August 7, 2010 (UTC)
Fire damage does do extra damage to armor. I also believe it unnecessary to list shredder ammo, as it doesn't serve to notably enhance the vanguard's natural skills. In my opinion, the guide pages do not need to list every possible build permutation. They should only list topics that are of particular note, and since the vanguard already has a another ammo power of remarkable similarity to armor piercing ammo, I thought it unnecessary to have it listed.
EDIT: Upon further investigation, it seems that incendiary ammo's page does not mention an effectiveness against armor. I believe it is mentioned in the in-game tips, however. I will investigate the matter further. GiantEnemyCrab 03:59, August 7, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict)AP ammo and incendiary ammo do different damage amounts and AP does extra damage, even more than incendiary ammo, to both. I would also agree that shredder ammo is unnecessary, as I don't use it on any build. However again while they are similar, they aren't the same. While no the purpose isn't to list every possible conbination, the point is to list powers that augment the abilties of the particular class, and AP ammo does more damage and has different effects than incendiary does, so it is a notiable bonus power. Lancer1289 04:14, August 7, 2010 (UTC)
I suppose you have a fair point. It still feel it's unnecessary, but I understand your reasoning for having it there. And fire damage does indeed do increased damage to armor regardless of its source. I will add that to the incendiary ammo page. GiantEnemyCrab 04:25, August 7, 2010 (UTC)

A question

Is it policy here to let orphaned talk pages to continue to exist, such as Talk:Glitches? OLIOSTER (talk) 21:28, August 8, 2010 (UTC)

Yes that is our policy to let talk pages continue even if an article is deleted. Lancer1289 21:29, August 8, 2010 (UTC)

Removal of questionable content

Recently I left a coded message within the Sentinel Guide (Mass Effect 2) questioning the usefulness of a certain passage; in your edit, you mentioned "this isn't how we do this". Would the talk page be more appropriate for a question like that? Flippantelf 16:25, August 9, 2010 (UTC)

See your talk page, but yes putting comments in articles isn't the best way to get changes. Acutally past experience has taught me that embedded text is usually ignored anyway, see Kasumi Goto and Talk:Kasumi Goto.
Thanks; I got your message after leaving this one, sorry for the clutter. The reason I left the embedded text is because I like working in source. Flippantelf 16:46, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
Well it's just that embedded text is very often ignored/overlooked, that putting it in usually ammounts to someone removing it becuase it is unnecessary. The best way to adress soemthing like that is to bring it up on the talk page. Lancer1289 16:51, August 9, 2010 (UTC)

Navigation Menu

Hey Lance, check this out. At the left navigational menu, under Mass Effect Series - Mass Effect / ME2, the listed order is a little inconsistent between the two subcategories:


  • ME - Characters, Talents, Missions, Assignments, Armor, Equipment, Achievements, Romances, ME Guide
  • ME2 - ME 2 Guide, Characters, Missions, Assignments, Armor, Armor Customization, Powers, Achievements, Romances

Suggested minor rearrangement (changes in blue):

  • ME - Mass Effect Guide, Characters, Missions, Assignments, Armor, Equipment, Talents, Achievements, Romances
  • ME2 - Mass Effect 2 Guide, Characters, Missions, Assignments, Armor, Armor Customization, Powers, Achievements, Romances

What do you think? Though I'd rather the "Mass Effect/ME2 Guide" be shorten to just "Guide" instead since it's already listed under its respective ME/ME2 subcategory. On a separate note, since I missed out in past discussions on the menu update, I am just wondering why the DLC category not listed under Mass Effect Series - Mass Effect/ME2? Thought it make perfect sense to have it under the respective series instead of a separate category. - Teugene 18:42, August 9, 2010 (UTC)

The whole sidebar redeisgn was worked out by Tullis and Silverstirke, jsut never implemented until a few months ago. Anyway I don't see a problem moving those things, consistency is good, but I do think that Downloadable content does deserve its own seperate section, but I'll ask Spart to give his opinion on this. Lancer1289 18:49, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
Great! While you and good ol' Spart talk it out, I shall now get that much needed sleep and see the discussion the next day. Till then! Teugene 18:57, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
P/S: Oh I just can't leave you alone right? Haha! I just remember another little thing: In ME Series - ME 2, it would be helpful if those links goes to ME2 sections in their respective pages. Example, the Mission links to Missions, Characters links to Characters, and so on. Teugene 19:04, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
You you can't seem to leave me alone can you. :) The links do already go to those sections, I think is a coding thing that wikia uses. I don't know for certain. Lancer1289 19:06, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
Looks good to me! :) SpartHawg948 20:11, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
Would that be for the changes or for DLC keeping its own section? Lancer1289 20:12, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
Yes. SpartHawg948 20:14, August 9, 2010 (UTC)
Ok then, modding the links inside series to match and kepeing DLC in its own section. Lancer1289 20:15, August 9, 2010 (UTC)

You're right about some wikia code preventing anchor links from working in the sidebar menu. There seems to be no solution or documentation on this anywhere else. The only other possible way I can think of is using redirection page, though that probably requires some extra work. Teugene 03:53, August 10, 2010 (UTC)

I'll ask one of the staff about it tomorrow nd see if there is anyway around it without redirects. Lancer1289 03:56, August 10, 2010 (UTC)

Thumb CSS

It's not quite as confusing as I remember, thankfully. Just replace

div.tright, div.tleft {
   border: 1px solid silver;

div.thumbinner {
   background: inherit;
   border: none;

#article div.thumb {

from MediaWiki:Common.css with the code from my or your monaco.css. This occurs right under the /* Image frame fix */ line and right above the /* === Babel === */ line. -- Dammej (talk) 00:03, August 11, 2010 (UTC)

It's working, it's working. :) Goodbye ugly thumb boxes. Still don't like them, but at least they are easier on the eyes. Lancer1289 00:07, August 11, 2010 (UTC)


We've got a mad vandal on the loose. He insists on having some sloppy, junk edit on the Weapons Locker page and leaves lewd and unnecessary comments on the talk and user pages of people who revert his edit. Tanooki1432 13:01, August 11, 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. He has to be stopped. Hope you'll ban his IP as soon as possible. Harbinger265 13:06, August 11, 2010 (UTC)

Since this moron doesn't seem to want to let up, maybe we should consider limiting the wiki to registered users only? I'd hate to screw a lot of unregistered users who make good, serious edits because of one idiot, but 90% of lawyers are good people, it's just the other 10% that give them the bad name (or something like that). I'm not saying lock the wiki down this instant, but he could easily get in during some off hours and wreck some serious havoc on the wiki that ruins the quality and subsequently no one ever visits this wiki again. Tanooki1432 19:25, August 11, 2010 (UTC)

Well that's the thing, we really can't do that, short of protecting every page, which I won't do, or at least as far as I know, but I also wouldn't do it. Yes there are bad seeds in every bunch, but I have come across plently of URs that make constructive edits, and only a few that really yank my chain, like this guy. All we can do is keep on the lookout, but I'll ask the staff if there is anything that we can do about it. I know admins don't have that kind of power. A lot of people come here, and I really don't see that changing becuase of one person. Again though I'll ask the staff about it and see if there is anything we can do becuase he is a a problem that won't quit. Lancer1289 19:30, August 11, 2010 (UTC)
I agree entirely on the URs. Maybe set up something like Wowwiki's report page? I can't view it right now, but if you go to wowwiki, hit the history of any article, there should be a little place where you can go to a page to report vandals and other miscreants. I don't know how it works, but if that page is edited by a non-admin, admin-types seem to appear on the scene really fast like. Tanooki1432 19:39, August 11, 2010 (UTC)
I know WoW wiki is almost 47 times our size; they have 84,401 articles, while we just have 1,806. We honestly don't have that much vandalism, usually just one per week, and it is usually caught before it gets to this height, they probably get it on a regular basis, and that only seems to be for registered users, not anons. Also, usually most people don't push it this much, like I know one person has a few months back, but we honestly don't get hit that much. Usually the best way is to contact an admin, provided they aren't asleep, as was the case here, but I would have to talk that over before it even moves into the project realm of maybe implementation. Again I'll contact the staff about it, and talk to Spart about that system, it may be a good idea, but I am really neutral on that option. Lancer1289 19:54, August 11, 2010 (UTC)
Acutally the World of Warcraft wiki doesn't even allow anons to edit! That's shocking. However that is something that I'd have to be against, making users regester before they can edit. I really don't like the idea of forcing that on people, and I'm positive that Spart wouldn't either. Lancer1289 19:57, August 11, 2010 (UTC)
You are correct. I 100% opposed to limiting editing to registered users. I was looking for an email I thought I'd saved from last time we had a big vandalism spree, and one that makes today's incident look like nothing. We're talking a multi-day spree with one guy coming back over and over, at least two or three times a day for about four or five days. At the time, I contacted Wikia to see if there was anything beyond simple banning that could be done, and the response I got was... pretty much no. They can impose a protection over the entire site, which would prevent un-registered and newly registered users from editing, but they expressed extreme reluctance to do that, as it's really a last resort type of thing. Alas, I appear to have deleted that email, as it was quite some time ago. SpartHawg948 21:39, August 11, 2010 (UTC)
Well he hasn't come back, so maybe we got all 6 or 7 of his IPs and the user name as well. Lancer1289 21:42, August 11, 2010 (UTC)

Caption fun!

Just a small idea, but I think a little caption contest like thing could be fun. Maybe once a month we find a picture, and people can add funny captions to it. I'm sure we could get some funny captions on a picture like this. Tanooki1432 19:39, August 11, 2010 (UTC)


<p />

Taken care of, hopefully. Lancer1289 19:36, August 11, 2010 (UTC)

Spreadsheet for Minerals

I noticed you edited out my spreadsheet in the upgrade guide? I just wondered why, I am aware the details are also on the upgrade guide but the spreadsheet allows the user to know how many minerals are required to get the remainder of their upgrades and the only reason I edited it was from request from a wikia user to add a discount feature to the spreadsheet. Ilovetelephones 21:14, August 11, 2010 (UTC)

Again why do we need a link to an external source, when all the information is presented in the guide. There was no reason to have a link to an external source for that, when the information is presented already. We don't have links unless they are necessary, which this wasn't, and even then they are references. Lancer1289 21:35, August 11, 2010 (UTC)
Do you honestly beleive people will keep track of every upgrade they purchase and the amount of minerals required to purchase the rest using a lump of data that lacks automated assistance? The information is present in the guide but it is not manipulated to the extent where it can be used as a checklist to make sure a user is not spending too much scarcely found money on farming minerals which is why I beleive the spreadsheet is a necessity, there is no feasible alternative on this wikia for that level of upgrade guidance, which is the title of the page. The spreadsheet has been there for a few months now and up until I edited it under the request of another wikia user today, there have been no complaints. Ilovetelephones 21:56, August 11, 2010 (UTC)
Yes I believe they can, and to be honest, I didn't even notice until today, but if I did, then I would have removed it. Just because something doens't have any complaints doesn't mean that no one saw it. I really don't think that we need an external link to something that is nothing more that what we have here. Even after examining it, I don't think it is necessary, and I don't think it should have been linked in the article. You are more than free to put something like that on your user page, but not in the article as it is an unnecessary link. Lancer1289 22:13, August 11, 2010 (UTC)

What do I do here?

Thanks for the welcome message, and sorry for my earlier Help message, but at that time I was slightly unfamiliar with the editing tools. But now, I have a question: as a new user, what can I do? I have read this wiki for a long time, but have only just joined, and I just do not know what to do. This wiki seems so complete. Any stub pages needs info that I do not have, the frequently linked-to lists are there mainly because they were deleted in the first place (I was going to restart the Sovereign Unique Dialog page, for example, until I read the talk page. Even so, I argue that the dialog was unique to him), and I find that the spelling and grammar on the article pages are nearly completely immaculate. So, any suggestions as just to what I can do? As I said before, this wiki just seems so complete. The Ogley 08:34, August 12, 2010 (UTC)

Well it's nice to know people actually do come here to read and that we are so complete from an outside perspective is always nice to hear. Back on topic, there are many things you can do, not all of the stubs have all their info, so fixing up a page can't go wrong, usually. Just even going around and looking at some articles, see if they are coherent, or not in line with the Manual of Style, and fixing it. Any edit, no matter how small helps. We are currently working on a policy for the redlinks so that really isn't an issue. And if you look at the rest of the UD pages, the Sovereign page really didn't match so that is the reason it was deleted. The only way it could have survived is if we wrote out every conversation and renamed the page, which I do not like the sound of. Too much wasted space and it is unnecessary. Again overall, just have a look around and see if there is anything, every little bit helps, that doesn't match up, just watch the US/UK spellings as we allow both. If in doubt check sites like, or leave it alone. I really can't think of anything else. Lancer1289 17:26, August 12, 2010 (UTC)


Thanks for the welcome!

Thanks for the welcome, i have a strong HTML understanding, but thanks for the styles page. I'm sure I can get something off of it. I dont see a spell check and i am a horrible speller... any suggestions?

Insuperable 02:55, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

Justin K.

Former C/ Lieutenant Colonel (Battalion Commander US Army JROTC)

Future Soldier

Screamin Eagle Airsoft Commander

Facebook | Screamin Eagle Airsoft

Well welcome, as to a spell checker, Wikia doesn't have one. I know that Firefox and Chrome do have spellcheckers built in, but with the Rich Text Editor, which you are probably using, you need to hit the source code button in the upper right hand corner of the edit window for it to work. IE doens't have a spell checker, so if you need one,just copy paste into Word or something will a spell checker, and then page back into the edit window. I don't use the RTE because I have a personal grudge against it, and a long list of reasons why I hate the thing. Lancer1289 03:24, August 13, 2010 (UTC)
Ah, okay well thanks for the firefox (just downloaded it)Where can I get a Kassa Fabrication License at?

Insuperable 04:03, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

With either the C-Sec Requisitions Officer on the Citadel. Or from Petozi on Noveria at Peak 15. However you must be at level 36 to get the license. See Armory license for mroe details. Lancer1289 04:08, August 13, 2010 (UTC)

why edit?

Why you deleted the comment on no renegade point after the renegade interrupt in overlord? It's factually correct, and any info regarding paragon/renegade points can be useful for other players.

Because there are even interrupts and decisions in the main game that don't give points, so it is unnecessary. Lancer1289 20:25, August 15, 2010 (UTC)
OK, but I doin't see why that makes it unnecessary - I actually feel like saying that those actions in the main game that give no Ren/Par points should be mentionned. Overlord is the only DLC which gives no Par/Ren points. I think it's an important point to mention, and I'm not the only one. Plus, it's factually acurate, so I really don't see what the justification to delete it could be.Micmicmac 20:36, August 15, 2010 (UTC)
And again there are decisions in the main game that don't give paragon or renegade points for interrupts or dialogue actions. IIRC Kasumi's loyalty mission doesn't reward you for morality decisions either. Lancer1289 20:44, August 15, 2010 (UTC)
There might be some sections in StolMem where you don't get ren/par points - I know for sure you at least get ren/par points when you bust the statue and depending on what you tell Kasumi to do with the memory chip. In any case, it doesn't invalidate my point. Overlord is the only dlc which gives no par/ren points at all... We might disagree on the relevance of this point, but in any case your job as an admin is not to take over the wiki as you please (or we both have a different understanding of what a wiki is), but to make sure the general rules are respected so all the community can contribute within the boudaries set by the wiki rules. Here is what's indicated in the help secton: "Edits may be reverted if they contain unsubstantiated speculation, poor spelling or grammar, or make changes such as converting alien races to upper case."
There is no mention about what the admin feels is relevant/necessary - there is no reason why your stylistic opinion as an admin should prevail over anybody else's opinion... I only wrote facts, more importantly facts pertaining to ren/par points, which is an important facet of the game. Micmicmac 21:11, August 15, 2010 (UTC)
Really I'm taking over and doing what I want? I uphold the standards and that doesn't meet it and it is not neecssary. If you had checked the history of the page, then you would have seen another user disagreed with you as well and removed it the first time also sighting it as "unnecessary". So it would seem that it is unnecesary. Not all rules and standards are listed, because if they are, then everything would be the size of a book. Every place has things that aren't written down and standards that are also not written down because there are examples all over of president. Niether of the edits is supported in any other article and are unnecessary.
Yes my job is uphold standards, but when somethings doesn't meet those standards, I have an obligation to remove it. I also take every question of my integeraty as a very serious insult, which you just did. As an admin I uphold standars and make sure everyone plays by the rules, and again neither of the edits are supported by president and are unnecessary for the articles. Lancer1289 21:23, August 15, 2010 (UTC)

"Canon Shepherd"

Since it seems there are those here who MUST have THEIR "canon", I say we give it to them... Here's my proposed improvement to the Shepherd page:

== Canon Shepherd == There is no such thing as Canon Shepherd. According to BioWare, the "canon Shepherd" is whatever the hell each individual player wants it to be.(insert source here). Canon Shepherd does not exist. Period. End of story. Take your "Canon Shepherd" arguements and shove them. BioWare hath spoken.

And yes, the bold, italics and underlines are necessary to beat the point home. Alternatively, we can use my suggestion in the Shepherd talk page. The sarcastic one that basically describes everysingle action that can be taken.Tanooki1432 17:55, August 16, 2010 (UTC)

It has been covered on the talk page a few times, and a few times elsewhere. It really wouldn't fit in the article because any fan of the series knows that BioWare refuses to set canon, and has stated several times that they won't. Some people just have to have canon, which you already stated, but it really wouldn't jive with the rest of the article. If people kept modifiying the article, then maybe it would be necessary, but since it keeps being brought up on the talk page, thankfully, we will just roll with the punches on this one. Lancer1289 18:01, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
Addendum: I also like the way BioWare is doing it, not setting canon and letting each and every person come up with their own canon. I currently have 27 Shepards, yes I have way too much time on my hands, and I consider each as much canon as the next. However they aren't official, and BioWare stated they aren't setting canon, which again I like. Lancer1289 18:06, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
Wow, twenty-seven?! I only have three! I feel horribly insignifcant. I do believe, however, that the closest to a canon Shepard is the one we are given if we have not played ME and and only played ME 2. Although that one is just a default, not canon. So yeah, noooo canon Shepard. MEffect Fan 18:15, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
You think you feel insignificant? I have a grand total of 1 Shepard. Tanooki1432 18:24, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict)Well I have also had ME for about 2 1/2 years now and I found myself with a lot of time, so I played it because I like RPGs. I don't have all 27 through ME2 yet, but I am working towards that end. However I also have a lot of other games for the 360, Xbox, Gamecube, N64 (yes I still play that), Genesis (yes I still play that too), and PC that I play as well. Currently I am playing Star Wars: Empiare at War, a great RTS. I will never play any other RTS on the console apart from Halo Wars, because you loose all the hotkeys, the mouse (a big pain), and being able to use the menus effectivly. I just had the time to do it, and I also have 5 full completions of Fallout 3, i.e. exploring every place, all the DLC packs, and all the quests, complete as well. I had way too much time on my hands when Fallout 3 came out. Lancer1289 18:28, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
Lancer, are you the legendary AAA? That guy leaves a legend to every video game he touches. I would play more video games, but my work demands me to be out of the house alot. I think I overwhelm myself. MEffect Fan 18:35, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
Ok I need some clarification on the AAA thing. Are you refereing to the AAA level of video games, which ME is apart of or something else? However I do like to play games, and usually do when I get the chance. Usually with friends if I can. Although I'm not one of those games who sacrifices friends and their life for video games, I go to the movies and places with my friends. Also I went to Six Flags Great America back on the 7th, which is why I wan't here for most of the day. Lancer1289 18:43, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
When playing an arcade game, like Space Invaders, the score screen would show the name typing part. You could type in a name and what not If it was a new game all the names would be AAA, even the highscore. I don't know, its a bad joke I got on Uncylopdeia. :P MEffect Fan 18:53, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
Ah that is what you were refering too. Well I would acutall sign with my initials rather than just AAA. However in any game I play, I try not to leave any stone unturned and play it to its fullest, because if I paid $60 for it, in the case of 360 games, $50 for PC, I want to get my money out of it. Lancer1289 19:00, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
True that, I always want to make sure I don't get bored when I purchase a game. Next game I plan on buying is Mafia II, then I will take time out of my sechdule to play it. So i hope it is worth it. MEffect Fan 19:05, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
I've thought about buying that, but I'm still on the fence about it. What I am looking forward to, before Christmas that is, is Fallout: New Vegas, Halo: Reach, Star Wars: The Force Unleashed II, and any further DLC pack for my existing games. Next year, I look forward to more chainsawing in Gears of War 3. Lancer1289 19:08, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
Well try the demo, its out now. I might pickup FNV and The Force Unleashed II. I always say that the Halo games have gotten overatted since Halo 3, so I say no to Reach. GOW 3 is a must buy for me. MEffect Fan 19:17, August 16, 2010 (UTC)
Well I might download the demo next time I log onto Live. I have my own reasons for buying Reach, so we disagree there, but April cannot come soon enough. Lancer1289 19:22, August 16, 2010 (UTC)

Placing screenshots

Lancer - I noticed you cleaning up some of the many articles to which I'm adding screenshots. A common thread in your summaries: "1. why are pictures inserted in the middle of paragraphs, 2. it looks sloppy in the code, (2b) shrinking image, and (3) removing pic wanted tag which should have been done in the first place". Numbers indicate points/questions I'll address. (1) How are pictures inserted elsewhere while editing? Dragging and dropping the image doesn't do anything. (2) Didn't know there was "code" (are you like Cipher in the matrix?), but I assume that's also the key to (1). (3) Being a new member, I didn't want to go around removing flags; but judging from your comment, I will remove them at my discretion. I'd like to help you not suffer through these page edits, so if you could tell me briefly the "how" to (1) and (2), I'd be grateful. AnotherRho 02:36, August 18, 2010 (UTC)

(edit conflict)First I do have to ask this question, which I always do with something like this. Are you using the Rich Text Editor? And if you are, then I have yet another reason to add to my very long list of why I hate the thing. If you are going to continue to use the RTE, then there is a button in the upper right hand corner that says source code. Clicking that will change it to the standard wiki-text input, allowing you to use the Spell checker in Firefox and Chrome, and to put images exactly where you want them to go. It just looks sloppy and confusing to say the least to have the code for an image right in the middle of a sentence. They usually go before a paragraph, and sometimes after, but never in the center. Lancer1289 02:53, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
As to the edit conflicted statments, the first two are based on if you are using the RTE. The third is just housekeeping. As images usulaly overlap templates, its is just annoying to look at. When a decent screenshot is added, then it is perfectly acceptable to remove the pic wanted tag. I will be readded, and depending on the situation, the image removed if there is a need for a better image, like the Batarian Engineer, poor quality compared to the rest. Again if you are using the RTE then please do let me know as that can solve most of the problems. And give me more reasons to list on my "List of Reasons I Hate the Rich Text Editor". Seriously I do actually have a list. Lancer1289 02:58, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
Thanks. Not sure how to navigate an edit conflict. - Anyway, I found the button of which you speak. Ironically, the reason why you found the code in the middle of a paragraph is that I was trying to get the darn pic to appear nearer to the beginning of the article. But why so much hatred? Has being an admin taxed you of joy in this fantastic Wiki?
Sooooo: yes, I was usign the RTE. Why else do you hate it? It seems to be the default mode of editing everything (I ask as one who does not know, since this is the first Wiki I've ever read, let alone joined). Yes, that engineer pic was annoying (the 3rd Torch room on X57 has such bad lighting. Don't they know Shepard might want to take pictures?). AnotherRho 03:06, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
The RTE has a very bad habit of messing things up in articles, image placement, unnecessary alais, formatting mixups for a few examples. Also note tha becuase of that, it has actually been banned by several wikis including the Dragon Age one. I also find using annoying becuase it just seem much easier to type and put in links using the code rather than the drag, drop, and all the other buttons that the RTE uses. Its more just personal preference ranther than just the fun being sucked out, but a long list of things that it does that usually result in an undo or a 5 minute editing window to fix the problem. There really hasn't been much lately but you like it, I don't, so let's agree to disagree. So since it is the default editor for new people, there is nothing I can do about that, I think. Lancer1289 03:15, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
I see. And fear not friend, I didn't say I liked it (only that it's all I knew of, until now). In the spirit of, um, Mass Effection, I'll try to start learning this newfangled code. AnotherRho 03:21, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
Well I have always found the wiki-text style, using the code, to be easier than trying to figure out the RTE. Tried it, don't like it. If it does become a problem, then we might have to do something, but that is an issue for another day. Lancer1289 03:53, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
So far I'm liking the code. It's so easy to link to pages on the Wiki. Thanks for your help! AnotherRho 05:40, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
No problem. Lancer1289 05:43, August 18, 2010 (UTC)

Systems listing

"According to the MoS, systems are to be listed in alpha order, not by orbit" I'm guessing that applies to all geo-political groups right? But the real question is: What is the MoS? I knew there had to be some kind of standard somewhere but couldn't find it.

PS: My apologies for the bad edit.

The MoS is short for the Mass Effect Wiki:Manual of Style. There are many link in there and the guide itself provides information for how we do things here. There is all the Mass Effect Wiki:Community Guidelines, which is the guidelines for behavior and such. Lancer1289 05:12, August 18, 2010 (UTC)

Shep Pics

Just so that I'm clear on things, it's totally cool to upload a picture of Shep that we've customized to our personal user pages right? Tanooki1432 15:21, August 18, 2010 (UTC)

There is only one person I know of who puts their Shepards on their user page. JakePT uses a table and pulls the photos from an external site, in this case If there is anyway you can avoid uploading them directly, then that is prefered. I'm sure JakePT would be happy to help with the external site links if you need it. Lancer1289 15:32, August 18, 2010 (UTC)

Video linking in articles

I was wondering about the policy of linking videos in articles. I am seeing a link in the article about Grunt and I wanted to remove it as I thought that videos do not get linked (barring few exceptions) but am fuzzy about the rules involved. Any help would be much appreciated. GrandMoffVixen 18:52, August 18, 2010 (UTC)

That is more of a case by case basis. Generally not in the main articles, usually on talk pages, however this is an exception. Becasue the YouTube video provides some of the dialogue for the Mordin vs. Grunt confrontation, and it is being used as a reference, it is ok. However again, this is a case by case basis as the validity of reference needs to be confirmed. Also it is trivia because I would have liked to see that confrontation. If you have any other concers, don't hesitate to bring them up. Lancer1289 19:26, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
Ok, I will remember this for future potential edits. Thanks! GrandMoffVixen 19:37, August 18, 2010 (UTC)
No problem. :) Lancer1289 19:38, August 18, 2010 (UTC)


Thanks for yelling at the guy who screwed with my coment :)Legionwrex 00:54, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

I didn't yell, but both Spart and myself take modification of comments by user's very seriously. And since Spart has banned the two for 3 months, just before I could, I don't think we will be hearing form him again. Lancer1289 00:57, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

I hear thatLegionwrex 00:59, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Indeed, hopefully we can put an end to these sock puppets who just like to argue. Although I'm sure that we don't have it as bad as place like Wookiepedia, Memory Alpha, Halopedia, or any other large wiki. We just seem to be getting a lot of vandels lately. I hope this will die down soon. However I see it starting back up once the PS3 version is released. Lancer1289 01:02, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Halopedia better get better im a member there, Anyways im starting to like the ME wiki better it has more "flavor"Legionwrex 01:13, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

I like Halopedia, but I hear they have some authority problems, however experience has taught me that rumors are usually just that rumors, with just a slight smattering of truth, usually microscopic size. So I wouldn't know. Lancer1289 01:17, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

CoD wiki also has problems. One user destroyed about 30 pages before being caughtLegionwrex 01:21, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Well I think they fixed that, however I am not a big fan of the CoD series so I don't go there very often, unless I need something. I ment that the rumor is that the admins on Halopedia are more authoratiative than they probably should be. That's the rumor anyway. Lancer1289 01:24, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Thats fineLegionwrex 01:34, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Deleted Images


I've notice that you deleted the Reaper IFF and the Harbinger images.

Two things.

1st What do you mean with "and we can do it without the HUD elements, no other pictures have them" ? Reupload the image without the HUD parts? If yes I can do it. I saved just in front of the Reaper IFF so I can take a better screenshot. I was searching it in the model packages in the CookedPC folder but I didnt found it.

2nd How are we sure that the Reaper at the center of the Reaper Fleet image is Harbinger? If the PDA Reaper is a speculation, the same is also with the Reaper Fleet image and it has to be removed. Unlike with Sovereign-Nazara we dont know the name of the Harbinger Reaper. In the Reaper Fleet image there are a few Sovereign and Harbinger type Reapers. We dont know how many Harbinger-Type/Class Reapers are in the Reaper Fleet so I think the image is correct for every one of them as long as we dont know the exact name of the Reaper from which the hologram (which the Collector General has) comes from and which Reapers are those in the images. Harbinger is not the real name of that specific Reaper, Harbinger and Sovereign are just names organics called them. It says "We are the harbinger of their perfection". That doesnt mean that its name is Harbinger. The same it was with Sovereign, just a name given by the Protheans. It could be any of the Harbinger-Type Reapers. If so, the only correct image for that specific Harbinger-Type Reaper is only the hologram in the Collector Generals room.

I believe that the image shows Harbinger and of course its obvious that it shows a Harbinger-Type/Class Reaper. Also Joker gives the PDA to Shepard after Shepard says to Illusive Man that Harbinger is coming, so I think that Joker shows Shepard how Harbinger looks like and propably the image is found by EDI scanig the Collector data.

Just my thoughts....No offence....

Sorry for my english.


The HUD elements are generally don't good in pictures, espeically if we can get a better image without the HUD elements. Also that really wasn't the best place, in the walkthrough where it was appropiate would have been better. We don't have the HUD in any other images, and that one stuck out like a small thumb.
As to the Harbinger image, there is a connection in the final cutscene, and this came up before and it was decided that there was enough evidence to say that was Harbinger. See Talk:Harbinger for more. However the datapad may have been describing the specs on a standard Reaper. We have no evidence that is Harbinger, while there is enough to say that the image currenlty up is. As such the caption wasn't appropiate for the article because it was speculation, which isn't allowed, and that particlular image has been removed several times now. Lancer1289 19:58, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
Ok I got it. I will do a better screenshot of the Reaper IFF and I will post it in the walkthrough section.
One more thing...How I tag my messages/posts?
And how can I quote another post?

Ok 1) Great it would be a good image. 2) You can sign your posts by using the signature button above the editing window or by using ~~~~. 3) This is a wiki, not a forum, you can't quote like you do there. Just continue the conversation in the same message. And as this is my talk page removing headline to merge with the above content. Lancer1289 20:42, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks!!! Image done. I couldnt get rid off those blue "markers" around the IFF. I took the screenshot with the Flycam. I tried everything from having Shepard in distance to trying take the screenshot from the back of the Shepard. All the time those blue "markers". SoulRipper 21:07, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

However it still does have those markers so it sticks out like a sore thumb. The image looks sloppy compared to the one just beneth and above it. I'm not an image taker, but there are several users who are. Dammej is one of the most proficent, so do contact him aobut this. Until then, because it is unchanged, I'll be removing it because it looks sloppy compared to the other images. Lancer1289 21:12, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
Im really sorry. I thought that blue markers wasnt part of the HUD. I did everything that I could to get a high res image but its imposible. That F******* blue marker wont go away. I did another image. I will post the image here and tell me what you think. Also was the position of the previous image good? SoulRipper 22:38, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
Reaper IFF
Yes that is much better. I'll just paste that in. Lancer1289 22:52, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Melee Guide

Check out my blog for what I have completed so far, let me know what you think or if we even need a melee guide. I for one though am bored to death with the typical gun fights, so I started running around bashing people with shepards fists and experimenting with high health and reave. Mictlantecuhtli 20:49, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Alright, no need to respond then. I will just leave it in my blog. Mictlantecuhtli 21:01, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
Again I don't like cross page converstions. Thank you. Lancer1289 21:08, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Screenshot category question

Lancer, I've 2 questions on the same subject: 1. Does one add a screenshot to that category by writing Category:screenshots in the summary while uploading the file for the first time?

2. Is it possible to add a shot that's already been uploaded to the screenshots category? If so, how? Would I do it by viewing the picture's file and clicking on "edit this page", and adding the category as one would do for any other page?

Thanks for all your help. AnotherRho 23:05, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

First I have a request in the link you have to the category, please place a : before Category, because otherwise my talk pages is in the screenshots category.
First Question: No the summery is for describing what the image is or what it is to be used for. To place it in the category, go the the file's page, click "Edit This Page", then at the bottom of the edit window, press the "Add category" button and type out the category.
Second Question: Yes and the answer is the same as the first.
Again please do add the : in front of Category in the link. I don't want to overstep my bounds here. Lancer1289 23:33, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
Sorry about the link business (but thanks for the tip!). And thanks for answering the Qs! --AnotherRho 23:46, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
That that always confuses new editors. The link to the categories must have a : in front of the word Category in order for it to link to that category. Anyway happy to be of help. Lancer1289 23:41, August 19, 2010 (UTC)
Just a quick note that you can actually add a category when you upload an image by using the summary box. I do it all the time Smiley. Loleil 00:26, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Well that's something I didn't know. Well as the old saying goes, you learn something new every day. Lancer1289 00:29, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Or in my case here, you learn something new every few minutes. Thanks for the tip. --AnotherRho 00:35, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Glad I could help. It's a great timesaver when you're uploading lots of images. Loleil 00:40, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Apparently I'll be sure to remember that. However since I don't upload images that often, I probably won't be making use of it. However I'll keep it in the back of my mind in case I do. Lancer1289 00:45, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Something to look at

If you could, I'd appreciate it if, at your convenience, you can take a look at the Combat (Mass Effect 2) page, specifically the new screenshots that have gone up, and then if possible comment on the Talk:Combat (Mass Effect 2) page, specifically the 'Screenshots' section. I commented a little bit on it, but without any real purpose or position, as I'm a little conflicted on this one. I think I'm starting to form an opinion, but we'll have to see. I'll likely sleep on it and see if any new developments arise while I do so. SpartHawg948 09:21, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

I'll be sure to comment but we are deciding the fate of two pages here as well. Lancer1289 15:52, August 20, 2010 (UTC)


can you help witth my users page .

What do you need help with? Lancer1289 19:30, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Wow. I think you have a not-so-secret admirer. All I can say is... WOW. I just looked again, and he even links to your archives and everything. Can you say creepy? SpartHawg948 19:57, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Creepy beyond what I will tolerate. Some of the links on his page connect directly to mine allowing users to edit it, which isn't something I like. Also considering he also mostly ripped off my page, especially with my battles of the week, I need to update that btw, I'm at a bit of a loss about what to do here with this apart from asking him to remove the links to my user space. I also deleted those archives as there wasn't much commenting. However the links to my user page is something I want taken down. I need some opinions here Spart as I am at a loss about what to do. Lancer1289 20:24, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
They're your archives and all that, so you'd be well within your rights to demand the links be removed. As for the stuff copied nearly verbatim off your userpage, that one is slightly trickier. You can also demand that those be removed (and I wouldn't blame you for doing so), and suggest he come up with something of his own, but that's really all you can do. If he refuses, that's pretty much it. This is pretty odd... haven't really seen any situations like this arise... well, ever. SpartHawg948 20:27, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Thanks I was going to ask that the links to my userspace, and especially the two [edit] links on his page allow users to edit my user page. Those need to be taken down as I can see vandels using it. However I am curious as to what I should do if he doens't as they link to my user page, which allows people to edit my page. But the content was what I really wanted to ask, I'll drop a message about the rest. Lancer1289 20:33, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Your battle write-ups are just so dreamy. :swoon: -- Dammej (talk) 20:34, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

Hmm... I guess if you need to you could protect your archives? I'm really not sure what else to do, as I'm not sure about just going in and editing his user page to remove the links. Let's see what sort of response you get first, then see about sorting it out. SpartHawg948 20:37, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
I'll drop the message and let's revist this in a few days to see what happens. However I don't like the idea of a back door to my user page, which is my property on this wiki by the standards we use. Again let's see what happens. Lancer1289 20:39, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Well, look at it this way. They do say that imitation is the highest form of flattery! :P SpartHawg948 20:48, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Yes that is what I always say, but the links is just something that I don't like. Espeically the ones that link to an edit window for my user page. Lancer1289 20:50, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

help me

i might need halp with that and placing some other stuff on

Like what exacly, I can't really be of much help if I don't know what you want to do. As to removing the links, all you have to do is just remove them by editing the page in general, or do you need help with that. If that is the case, then I need your permission to edit your user page. Again just tell me what you want and I'll do my best to help. Lancer1289 20:49, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict) Why would you need help deleting things? It's even easier than copying someone else's user page and pasting it onto your own. SpartHawg948 20:50, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Indeed, however I just need to know what he needs help with, although deletion is the easiest by far. Select the link while in the edit window, hit delete or backspace, and that should be it. Lancer1289 21:13, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

i don't know

i don't know what to do or wat to put down

Something original, maybe? Something that you thought up? As opposed to something someone else thought up, took time and effort to write, and that you copied? SpartHawg948 21:46, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
And again please pick a page as I don't like cross page conversations, so I'll do it here. Again please remove the links to my user pace, and espeically my user page, and come up with something that is unique to you as that is almost copied word for word from my user page. Lancer1289 21:48, August 20, 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, sorry if I'm seeming overly harsh, I just really don't like plagiarism, which is essentially what you have here. Someone copying the work of someone else, and then passing it off as their own through lack of proper citation and accreditation. SpartHawg948 21:49, August 20, 2010 (UTC)


your turn to help me. ok

And again what do you want help with. I can't help you if I don't know what you want help with. Also I am getting tired of the new messages, just continue a conversation and don't leave a new one unless it has no bearing on a previous one. And a responce to this one does have bearing so just continue this one, and please don't leave a new message. Lancer1289 22:50, August 20, 2010 (UTC)

M-920 Cain

" how is it irrelevent, its providing real world stats for something similar. relevent" 'Not relevant because it provides stats for something which, despite vague similarities to the M920 has nothing to do with the weapon itself.'Or would it be okay to edit the assault rifles page to include the history of assault rifles and the similarities current examples bear to those in ME?

Because the Cain works on the same prinicpal as a railgun and considering railguns are still in the prototype stage, and they are very big, providing real world stats for something that operates the same way is very relevent. There is no need to modify the assault rifles article bvecause whe weapons don't even operate the same way. However the Cain works like a railgun so providing some real world stats is relevent to the article. Also no need of rthe italics and please sign your posts. Lancer1289 00:46, August 21, 2010 (UTC)

Odd, I'm fairly sure I did leave a new message my mistake.

Providing real world stats for a weapon not directly linked to the M920 doesn't qualify as 'Trivia' (by the dictionary definition anyway). As I said, it is the same as adding the history of assault rifles to the assault rifles page.

As for the Italics I merely copy and pasted your edit summery and didn't think to change it.

This is as far as I can be bothered to argue this. Your an admin do what you want.

DetailedSubset 01:21, August 21, 2010 (UTC)

New players info

Hi, I've recently started out with Mass Effect 1, and the builds for different classes have been very helpful. However, Me and some of my friends are missing a recommendation on which order to spend your points as you advance through the game for the first time. I noticed in the history of the soldier class guide that there were some guidelines as to put your first points in to assault rifles since even the most basic of them can kill enemies in the beginning fairly easy. How come this information was removed? Was it out of date or Incorrect?

Is it possible to add a section in each of the class guides for a general idea of which order new players could spend their points? Especially since you cannot redo your points, it would be very handy. 18:54, August 21, 2010 (UTC)Mickey

Ok I have to ask, what is Mass Effect 1? Was there another game I missed somewhere?
Anyway the information was removed as part of the Class Guide Overhaul, but the information itself was very biased because information like that really doesn't belong in the guide, or at least the official guides. We do have a Forum:Character builds page for that kind of stuff. Points in a certain talent vary greatly based on personal playstyle, and having suggestions about how many points to place there seemed to be moving away from the guides purpose. Again we have a page for that kind of information, but points spent very much on personal playstyle and having words like "Recommended Minimum: 12", didn't fit well with the guide's purpose of providing an overview of the class and how best to use it. Not to influence decisions that are more based largely on personal playstyle. Lancer1289 19:08, August 21, 2010 (UTC)
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